Close Call

[misiek93]

I didn't mean to personally call you an *****, English is not my first language and sometimes things dont come out exactly how I want them so for that I apologize.
However I still think what you did falls into the dumb catergory and here is why.
I think what you did was stupid and the fact that you keep blaming the car for hitting you is just as ignorant, that's why I made the ***** comment - You hit the car not the other way around. I know exactly about you what you said in the first post and I base my opinion on that. You said a car hit you, last time I checked a single lane is not wide enough for a car and a motorcycle to occupy it at the same time, it doesn't matter what state you're in, you found that out the hard way. A car is entitled to the whole space lane to lane and just because it is legal to lane split it doesn't mean it's safe or that you're entitled to that space, because you are not. The car was there first and the driver has the right to use the whole space from lane to lane, it is your responsibility to make sure it's safe and clearly it wasn't safe since there was an accident.

Next you said, after you hit the car you continued on riding, got off the ramp and went to the gas station than checked out yourself and your bike, unless I missed something here that is pretty much leaving the scene of an accident. If you were so hurt and concerned like you claim you were how about pulling over to the shoulder making sure you're ok and getting back to the car driver who was still stuck in traffic and couldn't move anywhere since that was the reason you were lane splitting. I'm sorry if this offends you in any way but you can't have it both ways. The fact that you continued riding tells me that you weren't really that hurt or concerned about the damage again pretty ignorant in my opinion. No I personally wouldn't beat the crap out of you but you fully deserve it for that, I would just take your keys and wait for the cops to show up - I'm not a confrontational guy by nature.

I choose to ride and am fully aware of the risks, however I'm not going to increase the risk of getting run over by a car to try to take his space and save 30 minutes, not worth it in my book on any day. I'd rather get home to my family in one piece, but that's just me. Never called you a rookie and honestly it doesn't matter how much riding you have under your belt sometimes a stupid decision is a stupid decision and you should look at your own actions instead of blaming the car driver for hitting you. You were trying to take space he was entitled to not the other way around.

It just blows my mind that you don't even think that you were even partially to blame for this. You got lucky this time but when it happens next time you may not be so lucky essentially ruining some strangers day and possibly their future and that my friend is pretty ignorant and shallow in my book.

By posting this you were looking for input if not what was your reason to post it? To show how bad of a driver this person was? I'm sorry but from what you described above you were 100% to blame for this and you left a scene of an accident on top of it and that is something pretty idiotic in my book.

It sure seems easy for you to armchair quarterback this, but as you stated you illegally lane split where you live and tailgate, so you don't sound like you have much right to call me an ***** - yes I do the difference is I wouldn't blame the car for stopping to quickly I would say it was my fault for following to closely. I've been riding since I was 18 and have no accidents (knock on wood) so I guess I'm doing something right.

Your statement about how you'd "beat the crap out of" me is preposterous, and sounds like a bit of self ego-boosting. You'd honestly beat the crap out of a guy whom you just knocked silly with a 2 ton car? Nice. - No I wouldn't I was just trying to make a point, I would probably take your keys if I was able to catch up with you, but there are plenty of people out there who would take it to the next level and you never know how stable the other person is so why not stop on the shoulder right there but continue to ride for a while?

Let's think this through: you are in your car, and a motorcycle bounces off your right side as you are drifting to the left of your lane. He wobbles, recovers with his right foot still hanging off the bike. You follow him and attack him since he didn't stop. He's wearing full gear: armored jacket, gloved and boots, and a full face helmet. He's about 6'6 in boots and helmet, and you're gonna attack him? Yeah right! He wouldn't even feel your attack after what your car just did to him, but it's likely that you'd feel his adrenaline induced retaliation. Talk about compounding your problems! - If I'm in a car and some bozo tries to squeeze through and hits my car, then rides on and proceeds to get off the highway, well in my mind he is running and you can bet I would go after him and call the cops. I wouldn't attack him that's pointless but I would make sure the cops found his ***. in this day and age when you have video recorders at your fingertips it would make for a very easy case. Besides who do you think would win that altercation a 700 lbs motorcycle or 3700lbs car? Like I said before you don't know how stable or unstable the other person is, don't take all this so literrly I'm not saying I would do such a thing but there are plenty of people out there that would.

"What if that car moved over 6 inches and just plain ran you over?" -Well, he DID move over somewhere near 6 inches while I was right next to him. - MY POINT EXACTLY, you shouldn't have been there and IT IS YOUR FAULT not the drivers.

I did not ask for sympathy, nor did I ask for anger, insults or any of the like. I simply wanted to let other riders know of my situation so that maybe someone could gain something from it. - Anyone with half of imagination knows not to do that and what you did was asking for trouble and you paid for it.

 

[likembikem]

I have read a lot about lane splitting, and some of the stats I have read seem to show California has less 'motorcycles rear ended accidents' than the national average. Lane splitting is dangerous. Sitting stopped in traffic with a distracted cage driver behind you is too! I guess the best thing is to do what is best for the situation.

 

[likembikem]

Oh by the way Borgbiker, glad you escaped what could have been a worse situation. Hope your not too sore!

 

[KJShover]

Your statement about how you'd "beat the crap out of" me is preposterous, and sounds like a bit of self ego-boosting. You'd honestly beat the crap out of a guy whom you just knocked silly with a 2 ton car? Nice.

Several years back, when I was more quick tempered, a guy on his Harley was lane splitting (illegal here) he clipped my mirror, breaking it, and proceeded to ride off, I didn't hit him, he ran into me. I followed him to a parking lot. He gave me a stupid look and comment about how I needed to make room. He got rag-dolled right then and there.

.... He's wearing full gear: armored jacket, gloved and boots, and a full face helmet. He's about 6'6 in boots and helmet, and you're gonna attack him?

I wouldn't think twice about it, I've had worse stuffed in the back of my patrol car and this is before the department issued tasers, but I have some pretty good training behind me. This isn't the first time, I've heard "I'm 6'7, I'm 6'6...etc". What does height have to do with anything, that's only about an inch, inch and a half taller than I, in tennis shoes. In my shudo kan and aikido classes that didn't mean ****. Master Scott is way shorter than I. I'm thinking 5'10-11". Dude used me as an example and I was powerless to do anything about it:rofl_200: I know many who are 6' and under, who have flat out destroyed a larger opponent. Both in the ring as well as in a free-for-all bar brawling atmosphere.

It doesn't matter to me either way. Lately the trend up here , unfortunately, is to kill, shoot, stab or whatever the other person. There is court going on right now, for a guy (smaller than the victim) followed a man, who flipped him off, back to his work and proceeded to stab him to death in front of his son.

With that in mind, I think a sore foot is the better alternative, and I'm glad that's all that happened.

I don't see what the big pissing match is about, its just opinions. Just that, nothing more.

I was on a heavy rescue crew for a fire department, I've cut people out of their cars. I'm also a former cop, I've been on death notifications for the collateral damage that was done by people running from a cop. It doesn't stop me from liking Tim, we just have different experiences and opinions on some subject matter.

Everyone has their opinions and their reasons for forming that opinion. I have to respectfully request, that we keep it civil and on track. Or if it turns into a pissing match, I'll close the thread.

But this thread has the chance to be real informative, with the Ca riders talking about their experiences lane splitting. Others that weren't trained to or don't come from a state where it's legal, I can see where their opinions come from. This is a chance to pick up some interesting info.

Lets not ruin it with the slams.

 

[jbretthorton]

I don't get lane splitting.... very dangerous... As fruity as CA is, it amazes me that it is allowed...

 

[bazwell]

Ha ha. When I go to a club, and there is the big guy on the door, all muscle bound, with no neck, I don't worry too much. If theres a 5'8" girl next to him, I nod and give her a wink, just to be on the safe side.
Don't want her going all Kung Fu on me. :rofl_200:

 

[KJShover]

Ha ha. When I go to a club, and there is the big guy on the door, all muscle bound, with no neck, I don't worry too much. If theres a 5'8" girl next to him, I nod and give her a wink, just to be on the safe side.
Don't want her going all Kung Fu on me. :rofl_200:

LOL, In my younger years, I used to be a floorman at a few strip clubs. It was the women, either the dancers or the gals who caught their man at the club that gave the biggest problems :rofl_200:

 

[PDWeyand]

Ha ha. When I go to a club, and there is the big guy on the door, all muscle bound, with no neck, I don't worry too much. If theres a 5'8" girl next to him, I nod and give her a wink, just to be on the safe side.
Don't want her going all Kung Fu on me. :rofl_200:

+1 on that.

KJShover - Lets not ruin it with the slams. Everyone has their opinions and their reasons for forming that opinion. I have to respectfully request, that we keep it civil and on track.

+1 on that too.

I was not trying to slam anyone.
I drove OTR for 10 years and a local for 15 years before that everything from car wrecker to a semi wrecker, and various sized trucks and trailer configurations. I have sat in the driver seat for many hours and seen many things while driving. I was also on the fire dept. and seen my share of people getting cut out of vehicles. It does not matter what type of vehicle you drive, one mistake can be your last. Drivers get lulled in to believing that they are 'safe' on the road. And yes a motorcycle offers the least amount of body protection, so as we ride we must account for the risks we take and our personal safety. I agree that lane splitting is a good idea if done in a safe manor. I think it should be allowed in all the states. I feel the same way about helmets laws, if you are willing to take the risks then fine do not wear the helmet. I try to remain in control of what I drive no matter what it is and aware what is around me at all times.

 

[KJShover]

I was not trying to slam anyone.

I know you aren't. I've seen many a good thread go down in flames, so I was just throwing that out there early. This thread has the makings to be a good one.

 

[firefly]

Los Angeles traffic

 

[bazwell]

Los Angeles traffic

There is no way in hell I'd be sitting in that traffic. That's ridiculous!
Lane split the whole way.

 

[firefly]

There is no way in hell I'd be sitting in that traffic. That's ridiculous!
Lane split the whole way.

and that is for miles on end, I mean for the next 20 miles or more, if you don't split lanes you'll die of lung cancer or black lung. I added another photo.

 

[PDWeyand]

Yes Firefly that looks like traffic in any major city, New York , Chicago, Atlanta, St. Louis and most of southern California. I have sat in many hours of that mess in a semi and yes I wanted to split the lane in my semi. I loved the time it took me 6 hours to go from JFK airport to New Jersey to get on I-95. Or the time I sat in traffic on I-5 the day the biker that was splitting the lane and died that was almost 4 hours of sitting still. Or the time I came through Atlanta on a Friday evening rush hour with an oversized load, I had to have two lanes my load was 16 foot wide 14 foot tall and weighed 93,000 pounds. That trip through Atlanta took some 4 hours. And we will not about the construction in and around Chicago. The number of hours sitting in slow moving traffic there. I know all too well about traffic. But really it did not really bother me, I knew I would sit in it all the time. I tried to plan my route to miss most of the heaviest of the traffic when it could be helped. I am glad I live where I do. I do not miss traffic of the bigger cities. Ride safe when your in that.

 

[BorgBiker]

I think what you did was stupid and the fact that you keep blaming the car for hitting you is just as ignorant, that's why I made the ***** comment - You hit the car not the other way around. I know exactly about you what you said in the first post and I base my opinion on that. You said a car hit you, last time I checked a single lane is not wide enough for a car and a motorcycle to occupy it at the same time, it doesn't matter what state you're in, you found that out the hard way. A car is entitled to the whole space lane to lane and just because it is legal to lane split it doesn't mean it's safe or that you're entitled to that space, because you are not. The car was there first and the driver has the right to use the whole space from lane to lane, it is your responsibility to make sure it's safe and clearly it wasn't safe since there was an accident.

Actually, the lanes CAN hold a motorcycle and a car, it's called lane sharing. You ride between two lanes, often with your tires directly on the stripe separating those lanes. I was riding down the line between the two lanes - when I was still further back than the car, there was room to pass. When my front wheel was roughly even with his back wheel, that is when he moved over. It wasn't a swerve; if it was, I wouldn't be here. His moving over removed my space. I didn't try to take it from him, nor did I run into him. I was passing him, HE moved over. I don't know if it was ignorance, lack of energy, changing the radio or whatever. But he squeezed me in between his car and another, and I had zero room to maneuver. This was the cause. I was in a free space, he took it away.

You can say it's stupid to lane split. But it's much more stupid to CHOOSE to be stuck riding behind one car with a driver of questionable skill and in front of another equally scary driver. Thousands of drivers, each who's attention to driving is measured in a single digit of a percentage surrounding you, and sooner or alter the guy behind you will stop too late. Now you're a puddle. No thanks.

With lane splitting you can limit the amount of things you have to worry about. Done correctly, you can spend far less time worry about what's behind you, and focus on what's in front of you.

Now you want to rib me for not stopping, fine. I don't know if I was clear in my earlier posts, but if I didn't say that I should have stopped, I meant to say this. If I had my wits about me after the fact I would have. But having just experienced what I felt would surely be much, much worse, I was not thinking clearly. Imagine being almost smashed by two cars when you had been enjoying a ride only seconds earlier, and you still haven't really put the pieces together of what just happened. Now, think clearly!

No, it's not an excuse... just a what happened. I have done everything I could to atone for that, and the CHP officer I spoke with today agrees with me.

If you were so hurt and concerned like you claim you were how about pulling over to the shoulder making sure you're ok and getting back to the car driver who was still stuck in traffic and couldn't move anywhere since that was the reason you were lane splitting. I'm sorry if this offends you in any way but you can't have it both ways. The fact that you continued riding tells me that you weren't really that hurt or concerned about the damage again pretty ignorant in my opinion.

Try hitting your leg with a two ton hammer. The way it felt, I didn't know that I'd be able to stand on the leg, much less if I'd be able to get back on and ride home. There is NO shoulder in the center lane, it's right up against the divider fence/wall. On the far side of the freeway (which is 5 lanes away if I remember correctly) is the only shoulder. Stopping on the that shoulder between moving cars and a 7 foot or taller wall so I can see if I will fall over didn't seem too smart to me. I went where I wouldn't be run over, and where I could sit and wait for ambulance, family, or whoever I could get to come for me. Luckily I found myself in better shape than I felt.

I've tried to be nice here, but you should think more closely about what you type to other people here. The way your wording comes off is often insulting and seems formulated to offend. You can blame it on having a language other than English as your primary, but whatever the excuse, it comes off the same way. If you don't care what others think of you, that's fine. I'll try not to be angry, or offended.

 

[BorgBiker]

Several years back, when I was more quick tempered, a guy on his Harley was lane splitting (illegal here) he clipped my mirror, breaking it, and proceeded to ride off, I didn't hit him, he ran into me. I followed him to a parking lot. He gave me a stupid look and comment about how I needed to make room. He got rag-dolled right then and there.



I wouldn't think twice about it, I've had worse stuffed in the back of my patrol car and this is before the department issued tasers, but I have some pretty good training behind me. This isn't the first time, I've heard "I'm 6'7, I'm 6'6...etc". What does height have to do with anything, that's only about an inch, inch and a half taller than I, in tennis shoes. In my shudo kan and aikido classes that didn't mean ****. Master Scott is way shorter than I. I'm thinking 5'10-11". Dude used me as an example and I was powerless to do anything about it

I know many who are 6' and under, who have flat out destroyed a larger opponent. Both in the ring as well as in a free-for-all bar brawling atmosphere.

It doesn't matter to me either way. Lately the trend up here , unfortunately, is to kill, shoot, stab or whatever the other person. There is court going on right now, for a guy (smaller than the victim) followed a man, who flipped him off, back to his work and proceeded to stab him to death in front of his son.

With that in mind, I think a sore foot is the better alternative, and I'm glad that's all that happened.

I don't see what the big pissing match is about, its just opinions. Just that, nothing more.

I was on a heavy rescue crew for a fire department, I've cut people out of their cars. I'm also a former cop, I've been on death notifications for the collateral damage that was done by people running from a cop. It doesn't stop me from liking Tim, we just have different experiences and opinions on some subject matter.

Everyone has their opinions and their reasons for forming that opinion. I have to respectfully request, that we keep it civil and on track. Or if it turns into a pissing match, I'll close the thread.

But this thread has the chance to be real informative, with the Ca riders talking about their experiences lane splitting. Others that weren't trained to or don't come from a state where it's legal, I can see where their opinions come from. This is a chance to pick up some interesting info.

Lets not ruin it with the slams.

I hope no one thinks I was slamming anyone. If someone took it as such, I apologize, that wasn't the intention.

I addressed the statement about kicking the crap out of me as being preposterous (or silly). In my opinion that's just someone trying to make himself out as being a baddass on the internet. Although it could be conceived as a threat (although I didn't take it that way)

My statement regarding the height wasn't intended to convey a threat, but rather a picture of what an angry driver running up to attack me in that scene would have seen. And I have been attacked while wearing full helmet, armored jacket and everything (drunk bikers) and I didn't feel a thing. I'm 6'2, neither huge nor small, and there are definitely tougher guys out there. But when you're pumped up on adrenaline, and can't feel the hits, you can focus on eliminating the problem.

Heh, now an officer of the law is another story. I have friends in the military, and in various police forces. I respect what they do, and I show them that. Plus, I know what kind of training and equipment some of them have, and I "pitty da fool" that decided to resist them.

I have one friend who is a State Trooper in Texas. He's only 5'6, but he was 265lbs, and he was benching 380 when he was 16 years old. Back when he worked in the jail, he earned the name "the Extractor" He could go into a cell by himself and get any resistant inmate out, by himself. Then he started with the deputy training, and continued with the Trooper training, and then martial arts. There is no way I'd mess with him, he's like a fireplug Chuck Norris!

Anyways, If I stepped out of line, I'm sorry.

And to everyone- thanks for your input, opinions (whether I agree or not :tongue: ) well wishes, and tolerance of my exceedingly long posts. I need some beer to slow the brain down, so my posts will be shorter :th_drink:

 

[BikeShack]

Wow! And I thought that my postings were inflammatory...

I lived in So. CAl. 22 years from '84 to '06. During this time I rode countless times in Asia and So. America as well... So I KNOW a little about California and tight spaces driving as well. I now live in a bucolic and 'awesomely' beautiful Mid-West town where splittng lanes in NOT allowed.

Am I good at splitting lanes.. effin YEAH... will I do it again... EFFIN NO.

Having said that... the only times in my life I splitted lanes was when cars were FULLY stopped or moving less than 5 miles and hour. While splitting I never moved faster than 10-15 mph. AT such speeds (or lack of) I have enough time to react.

This whole lane splitting business is a CALCULATED risk period... variables such as : space for maneuvering, time for response, lane speed, bike speed, weather, visibility, location, etc... all count. I don't know of a formula to help anyone safe in this circumstances... however giving the COST of a mistake (your life) I would not gamble.... But again I hate Las Vegas and never care for gambling (and just for the record... my 'distant' relatives back in the 50's owned illegal cassinos in other parts of the world... so I have nothing against gamblers.. that is just not my cup of tea).

If you want to get there on time... try leaving earlier.. IT ALSO WORKS.. try it. )))))))))))

Bottom line is: to each its own... nature and natural selection will do the 'dirty' job for us...

Cheers,
Amaury

Guys you comment about splitting lanes without having experience with it, yes in other states car drivers get mad but here they open up the road or move in their lane to let us pass, car drivers here are very tolerant of bikes splitting lanes only the out of state drivers get bunched up.
the more attention I am paying the less likely I'll get in an accident, every day I ride cars cut me off without seeing me, open doors, veer in my lane, stop at green lights, people cross the street from any point, homeless people with a cardboard singe walking between cars, elderly with poor vision, drunk, stoned drivers, texting & looking at GPS's, drinking, eating, putting makeup. teenagers & on & on. you guys are lucky to have open roads and no traffic congestion, I have 77,000 miles on the bike all lane splitting on a daily bases & I am not a reckless rider or a squid.

 

[KJShover]

What I think is really unnerving is this piece of ****.

http://www.unionleader.com/article/20110513/NEWS03/110519957/1001

 

[misiek93]

What I think is really unnerving is this piece of ****.

http://www.unionleader.com/article/20110513/NEWS03/110519957/1001

This is sad, unfortunatelly you hear this more and more where someone snaps for no apparent reason. I really hope they throw his *** in jail and why did the judge let him keep his license if he makes bail? I don't get it.

 

[PDWeyand]

What I think is really unnerving is this piece of ****.

http://www.unionleader.com/article/20110513/NEWS03/110519957/1001

And if they took his Driver lic he still would drive. He own's the road as we all can see.

 

[farleydog]

This makes me glad I live in Nebraska, except for the weather. Wide open interstates and highways. Just not much scenery. I assumed lane splitting was illegal everywhere. Learn something new everyday.