Gen 1 vs Diavel

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propwash

Active Member
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Fort Lauderdale
Today I was taking a local cruise on my new (to me) 99 Vmax. Some bozo on a Diavel zoomed by me, gunning it loudly as he went by (and cranking his throttle madly at the stoplight). This is in the middle of heavy traffic, mind you. Got me wondering, how does a Gen 1 stack up against a Diavel? I see lots of posts on Gen 2 vs Diavel but nothing on Gen 1.

By the way I have no pretensions on taking any bike - even a scooter. I am hideously cautious...I'm that one guy riding his max like a granny, lol. :scooter 1:
 
It doesn't matter how you ride as long as you enjoy the ride. I'm like you. I don't pass over a double yellow. I'm not comfortable on the twisty roads yet, but any time I'm on my Max I'm enjoying myself.
 
I think there are more of us careful V-max guys out there than you think. That's why we're here to talk about it. A good rider on a Diavel should be able to go faster than a gen 1 due to power/weight/tech. A crappy launch and a missed shift can really mess that up, though. Sounds like you'd probably not race people on the street (like me). Good plan.
 
No. Long before owning the max I've owned a few cruisers, while all my friends owned sportbikes. I've always enjoyed relaxed riding, maybe I'm old before my time, lol.
 
i think there are more of us careful v-max guys out there than you think. That's why we're here to talk about it. A good rider on a diavel should be able to go faster than a gen 1 due to power/weight/tech. A crappy launch and a missed shift can really mess that up, though. Sounds like you'd probably not race people on the street (like me). Good plan.

+1
 
Coming back from the Ft. Lauderdale Toys for Tots Run several years-ago, I was on I-595 headed east towards the Atlantic Ocean. Traffic was moderate, and because of the number of motorcycles attending, there was a higher-than-normal two-wheeled presence. I was on my VMax, holding my place in traffic.

Suddenly, a helmetless custom Harley rider sporting a 300-series rear fattie (the tire, not the passenger) came roaring up behind me. I saw him coming in the rear-view mirrors, and he was being stupid and careless, no lane change signaling, not being courteous when passing cars, cutting in-front of those he passed very quickly, and with the unmuffled roar from his straight-through pipes, he was epitomizing the obnoxious motorcyclist to the other motorists, and doing it very well. He came by me, did the 'I just cut in-front of you, bye-bye!' maneuver with a great roar from the exhaust, and much throttle-tweaking, and then changed lanes again. This time, though he came-up behind someone who had to slow-down because of traffic ahead, and to his disappointment, the guy he had just passed with such fanfare, was now passing him! How could that be? Didn't the other motorists notice the custom paint, the fat rear tire/wheel, the fearless helmetless rider, and his roaring exhaust, and move out of his way? No, they didn't, and now, he was caught in slower traffic, and rapidly falling behind someone he had just passed, me.

With a sudden swerve, and a blat of exhaust, he suddenly changed lanes, falling in behind me, and started his rapid passage trying to catch up to me. The road ahead was clear, but we were approaching a turnoff for I-95. Try as he might, his expensive custom was no-match for the guy in-front of him, who was on a 'rice-burner.' As we came to the I-95 turnoff, he suddenly shot into the right-hand lane, cutting-off a cage, and his shirt flapping in the wind, went fiercely parading down the ramp, towards Miami. He just didn't have the moxie to be able to catch and to pass that 'ricer!' But he sure tried to make-up for his delay in traffic slowing him, while the VMax just passin' through, receded into the distance.

People will try you all the time, be they Civics with nasal drone exhausts, Camaro SS's, lifted V8 pickups, BMW's, you name it. Stay out of their way. They may have a date with destiny, and destiny frequently collects the careless or reckless driver or rider, and rewards them in a very unfortunate fashion.
 
I know this is an old thread, but I need to put my .02 in. The only people I’ve ever had any issues with are Mustang drivers. Not the classic Mustang drivers, the 2000 something up drivers. It never fails - I pull up to a light next to a 19 year old kid driving one and he thinks he’s freakin speed racer. The Mustang starts howling with its raspy custom exhaust tone, the kid starts staring me down while twitching like a tweeker, the light turns green, and he gives the car hell off the light. With both my max and my R6 that I used to own, I count to three then blow his doors off as long as traffic is clear. One of two things happen after the Mustang gets chewed up and spit out - it either hangs waaaaaaaay back or immediately turns off. I’ve been riding for 17 years and it still amazes me that nearly stock cars still try to take a bike. Unless they’re exotics or heavily modified, there’s no way a car will take a bike. I like to emphasize the power to weight ratio and knock some of these fools down a few notches every once in awhile!
 
I know this is an old thread, but I need to put my .02 in. The only people I’ve ever had any issues with are Mustang drivers. Not the classic Mustang drivers, the 2000 something up drivers. It never fails - I pull up to a light next to a 19 year old kid driving one and he thinks he’s freakin speed racer. The Mustang starts howling with its raspy custom exhaust tone, the kid starts staring me down while twitching like a tweeker, the light turns green, and he gives the car hell off the light. With both my max and my R6 that I used to own, I count to three then blow his doors off as long as traffic is clear. One of two things happen after the Mustang gets chewed up and spit out - it either hangs waaaaaaaay back or immediately turns off. I’ve been riding for 17 years and it still amazes me that nearly stock cars still try to take a bike. Unless they’re exotics or heavily modified, there’s no way a car will take a bike. I like to emphasize the power to weight ratio and knock some of these fools down a few notches every once in awhile!

I believe a He'll cat or new Demon might change your mind.A Demon has faster 0-60 and quarter mile times than a stock gen 1.
 
On paper the diavel is faster. A lot depends on the rider though, especially on the street (not saying you plan on street racing). I have a ton of videos of me beating bikes that are significantly faster on paper. If you get a good launch on these guys, they are going to have to work hard to come around you before the finish. Couple weeks ago at the track, I beat a guy on a ninja, but he trapped like 15mph more than me. Moral of the story, the diavel making its best pass and the vmax making its best pass, diavel takes the cake.
 
This was Dale Walkers advice on how to launch a Vmax.

I guarantee you lower your ET's and be more consistent using my technique at the strip. This is how I ride the V-max only, not necessarily other models.
I could go on all day on how to launch a V-max at the strip. I’ll give you a few tips. Before I go into that, here’s a couple of other points.

I’ve run in the tens 10:50 to 10:90 on several V-maxes well 6 or 8 anyway. Two for magazines and others where on customer’s bikes. I weight 170 lbs race ready in leathers and helmet.

Keep in mind I’ve made over 20,000 passes and have set over 50 production records on variety of motorcycles so don’t be hard on yourself for not posting those big numbers. I also ran a drag racing school sponsored by Kawasaki in the late 80’s.

The V-max pee wee Jay Gleason rode was a pre-production bike that was positively massaged. Jay also at the time weighed about 130 lbs suited and could ride equal to myself. So power to weight ratio is a biggy.

I have found that when you can milk everything from a production bike with your riding talent that every ten pounds is worth about 6-8hundredths.

Many of the magazines these days correct the times for sea level. I wish they would post the numbers on the time slip then tell you the temperature, track and altitude where the test took place. This would be much more of a real world test in my opinion. All the ET's I ran were on the scoreboard not corrected. The tracks were Fremont raceway and Sacramento Raceway in California. Both can be very fast or 3 tenth slow depending on tail wind, temperature, day vs. night, etc. There are many factors...


Problem:
Most riders get too eager and turn the throttle too early and slip the clutch when they launch. This causes you to spin up the RPM, burn up clutches and wheelie or get sideways when the clutch does engage or just plain be inconsistent.
Answer:

Do your burnout in second gear to heat the tire. Be sure to let the clutch out quickly with the front brake clamp tight and apply throttle. Start with the tire in the waterbox then roll forward to the edge of the dry pavement before letting the clutch out. WARNING: never get the front tire wet. Always back in to the bleach box.
Get in your launch riding position early not while staging. Feet back a little near rear foot peg area on the ground, arms slightly bent leaning upper body forward. Your body should be in a straight line from a side view with a lean forward look.



Clutch and throttle control: I call my V-max technique the loft out method

Pre-load the clutch just so the bike does not creep. Do not hold into the grip. By doing so, you have no clutch control whatsoever.- try to launch from 4000 to 6000 RPM. Start at 4000. Keep the throttle very steady. Do not blip the throttle or let the throttle creep up!. This is crucial. When the light comes down start to slide the clutch out aggressively. This doesn't mean dump it or slip it. Do not turn the throttle yet! When you hear the exhaust, note pulling down its time to let the clutch engage fully and at that exact moment begin to roll into the throttle and drive through the bog. If you feel it bogged too much then try 500 RPM higher on the launch until you find that sweet spot for your weight and track surface. Remember clutch first then throttle. This is the key to control the front wheel lift, wheel spin and consistent launches without clutch damage.
Be sure to let your Max cool down between runs and do not let it run in the staging lanes waiting to make your pass.

If the fan kicks on or you let the temp gauge climb too high, you take the clutch out in a heartbeat.

I know a lot of you are probably sold on some type of synthetic motor oil. Well good luck at the strip. The clutch will go away much sooner when running it.

Remember to be smooth when rolling into the throttle not just snap it open. The V-max is pretty torquey and this can ruin a good launch.



The rest of running a low ET at the strip

Be tucked in by the time you get in second gear. I call this getting under the paint. This really helps ET and MPH especially on a non-fairinged bike like the V-max.

A properly tuned V-max with a 4-1 exhaust will pull up to 10,000 RPM. I know your saying: but on the Dyno my peak power is 8,900 RPM so why turn it so hard. Well this is why: the trans has too much of a gear drop from each gear and they shift much better if you buzz the motor up. I've found 10,500 is unnecessary. 10,000 to 10,200 seem to be the sweet spot on the ET and MPH.

Shifting techniques: Power shifting will run the best ET's. But unless you have a very good shifting bike, it can be hard on parts. Also if you miss a shift you could tag a valve. Power shifting is when you hold the throttle full open and fan the clutch just enough to complete the shift. I've ridden a few V-maxes where I could power shift 1-2-3 but had to back off and use the clutch to make it hit 4th. These were new bikes as well.

I highly recommend my Electric Powershifter 2 with reversed shift linkage. This allows a one up four down pattern that's much more positive. My Powershifter allows full throttle clutch-less shifts by interrupting the ignition momentarily. This allows for a fast smooth gear change. The clutch stays fully engaged saving clutch plates and the basket from getting hammered during shifts.

Stay tucked tight through the last MPH light then slowly roll out of the throttle and sit up. Once you've reached about 110 MPH apply gentle even braking.

If you ever hit something on the track or develop a speed wobble never clamp on the brakes. The best thing to do is pull in the clutch and keep a tight grip on the bars until you come out of it.

Go change your underwear.


I hope you consider this a good contribution to the list (Vmaxtech). I have a drag racing riding instructional video and booklet set if anyone is interested.

Yours Truly,

Dale Walker

http://www.vmaxoutlaw.com/tech/launching.htm
 
I know this is an old thread, but I need to put my .02 in. The only people I’ve ever had any issues with are Mustang drivers. Not the classic Mustang drivers, the 2000 something up drivers. It never fails - I pull up to a light next to a 19 year old kid driving one and he thinks he’s freakin speed racer. The Mustang starts howling with its raspy custom exhaust tone, the kid starts staring me down while twitching like a tweeker, the light turns green, and he gives the car hell off the light. With both my max and my R6 that I used to own, I count to three then blow his doors off as long as traffic is clear. One of two things happen after the Mustang gets chewed up and spit out - it either hangs waaaaaaaay back or immediately turns off. I’ve been riding for 17 years and it still amazes me that nearly stock cars still try to take a bike. Unless they’re exotics or heavily modified, there’s no way a car will take a bike. I like to emphasize the power to weight ratio and knock some of these fools down a few notches every once in awhile!



I seen this and of course had to reply lol. As far as the mustangs, I wipe them with my wife’s Subaru Legacy GT running a slight tune, and they never pull up next to me afterwards haha. Something about getting your ass handed to you by a 270hp 4 banger... lol. But on second note, my boss has a heavily modified Pontiac G8, and we run about the same time in the 1/8, his car vs the Vmax. I’m a very firm believer that if he did a little more tuning, it’d kill my max. He leaves posi marks for maybe 50’ or so. Pretty impressive lol


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