Question/Sanity Checking on Upcoming clutch job.

[DocDoom]

Hey everyone, new to the forum but long time lurker. I got the max about a year ago, had a huge amount of work done to it, and all is right in the world, minus the clutch.
Somewhere amidst a lengthy stop and go beach cruise it stopped putting any significant power to the ground, so I think it's due for some new plates. This only happens when hot, engine kind of spins up without catching traction.

I'm writing this mostly to aggregate the parts in one place and see if I'm doing anything way wrong. I have never cracked it, idk what's in it. If the DD mod is present because my clutch sucks I'm removing it. If anyone wants mt to video it for youtube in a way that isn't really old, I can do that.

If the wire is there I will yank it and replace the last friction half plate with a full one.

Using this for reference:
2002 Yamaha V-MAX (VMX1200P) Clutch | Yamaha Sports Plaza

Plate seat (5) and spring cushion seat (6) stay with this wire removal and full plate insertion right?
7 is the half plate to be yoinked along with (4)
Does (8) stay in there? 26H-16324-10-00 or is it removed with the new plate addition (I assume it stays). Should I get a new one?

Parts list otherwise
Gasket, Crankcase Cover part number: 3JP-15462-01-00
from:
2002 Yamaha V-MAX (VMX1200P) Crankcase Cover 1 | Yamaha Sports Plaza

Quantity 2-3 lets be honest.

Plate, Friction 3 (quantity 7+1=8): part number
26H-16307-00-00
From: 2002 Yamaha V-MAX (VMX1200P) Clutch | Yamaha Sports Plaza
Plate, Clutch 1 (quantity 6): Part number 26H-16324-10-00
from:
2002 Yamaha V-MAX (VMX1200P) Clutch | Yamaha Sports Plaza

1. Open it up without warping, yank em. Scuff the new steels and soak with new friction plates.
2. Remove piano wire thing, remove clutch plate (8) and remove half steel.
3. Reinsert full width disc (if not replacing spring and cushion) then plate 8, then alternate friction and steels until complete.
4. Use torque wrench to torque to spec properly with star pattern.
5. Apply super thin layer of gasket sealant to gasket and put it back together.
6. Profit

Is this all fair? I was thinking about replacing clutch fluid after this, but maybe not, see how it goes for a bit.
Thank ya'll so much.
Ken

 

[Fire-medic]

Delray Beach isn't far, welcome.

Yes, #7 & #4 get pulled/omitted when using another of the friction discs.

One extra clutch cover gasket should be enough.

Ensure that all the old bonding agent and clutch cover gasket material is removed w/o gouging the gasket surfaces. As you are going to do, a light smear on both sides of the gasket is good. You shouldn't have gobs squeezing out of the joint when you torque-down the cover screws. If you do then you probably are going to have the same issue on the inside, and possibly detached gasket cement could plug an oil passage.

Replace your brake/clutch fluid if it's opaque, it's a good habit to do every couple of years, by doing that you are removing water from the system, and preventing corrosion of the internals.

 

[gentsvmax]

Hey everyone, new to the forum but long time lurker. I got the max about a year ago, had a huge amount of work done to it, and all is right in the world, minus the clutch.
Somewhere amidst a lengthy stop and go beach cruise it stopped putting any significant power to the ground, so I think it's due for some new plates. This only happens when hot, engine kind of spins up without catching traction.

I'm writing this mostly to aggregate the parts in one place and see if I'm doing anything way wrong. I have never cracked it, idk what's in it. If the DD mod is present because my clutch sucks I'm removing it. If anyone wants mt to video it for youtube in a way that isn't really old, I can do that.

If the wire is there I will yank it and replace the last friction half plate with a full one.

Using this for reference:
2002 Yamaha V-MAX (VMX1200P) Clutch | Yamaha Sports Plaza

Plate seat (5) and spring cushion seat (6) stay with this wire removal and full plate insertion right?
7 is the half plate to be yoinked along with (4)
Does (8) stay in there? 26H-16324-10-00 or is it removed with the new plate addition (I assume it stays). Should I get a new one?

Parts list otherwise
Gasket, Crankcase Cover part number: 3JP-15462-01-00
from:
2002 Yamaha V-MAX (VMX1200P) Crankcase Cover 1 | Yamaha Sports Plaza

Quantity 2-3 lets be honest.

Plate, Friction 3 (quantity 7+1=8): part number
26H-16307-00-00
From: 2002 Yamaha V-MAX (VMX1200P) Clutch | Yamaha Sports Plaza
Plate, Clutch 1 (quantity 6): Part number 26H-16324-10-00
from:
2002 Yamaha V-MAX (VMX1200P) Clutch | Yamaha Sports Plaza
Open clutch surgery is not all that. This is a great little project to build pride, confidence and knowledge in your Vmax maintanance. Gather your parts, tools and a well lit, clean work area. You'll have no problem. Dont over think it. Then feed that Mod Monkey with the cash you'll save by doing it yourself.

Gent

1Open clutch surgery. Open it up without warping, yank em. Scuff the new steels and soak with new friction plates.
2. Remove piano wire thing, remove clutch plate (8) and remove half steel.
3. Reinsert full width disc (if not replacing spring and cushion) then plate 8, then alternate friction and steels until complete.
4. Use torque wrench to torque to spec properly with star pattern.
5. Apply super thin layer of gasket sealant to gasket and put it back together.
6. Profit

Is this all fair? I was thinking about replacing clutch fluid after this, but maybe not, see how it goes for a bit.
Thank ya'll so much.
Ken

 

[gentsvmax]

Something went wrong there in that reply.
Open clutch surgery is not all that. This is a great little project to build pride, confidence and knowledge in your Vmax maintanance. Gather your parts, tools and a well lit, clean work area. You'll have no problem. Dont over think it. Then feed that Mod Monkey with the cash you'll save by doing it yourself.

 

[MaxMidnight]

Do it on the side stand and you won't loose much oil.
IMO if the mating surfaces are flat then there is no need for any jointing compound.

 

[Fire-medic]

Do it on the side stand and you won't loose much oil.
IMO if the mating surfaces are flat then there is no need for any jointing compound.

I agree that you can often skip the gasket sealer, assuming things are smooth and not irregular or gouged, but it doesn't hurt anything to use a thin skin on the gasket, both sides.

Another product I sometimes use instead of a room-temperature vulcanizing compound/gasket cement is water-soluble gel like KY. It helps to hold gaskets in place during reassembly and is easy to use. Again, not much is necessary.

 

[TK3333]

4. Use torque wrench to torque to spec properly with star pattern.

This is crucial to not stripping out the threads in the case and not having a leak imo.
Not sure if it was mentioned but it is a good idea to trace the new gasket on card board and as the cover screws come out, put them in the proper spot on your newly made template. There are different length screws and this will keep them in order, assuring they go back in the proper hole.
Taking lots of pictures as each piece comes off. This will help everything go back the way it came out. Like this.....

 

[DocDoom]

I agree that you can often skip the gasket sealer, assuming things are smooth and not irregular or gouged, but it doesn't hurt anything to use a thin skin on the gasket, both sides.

Another product I sometimes use instead of a room-temperature vulcanizing compound/gasket cement is water-soluble gel like KY. It helps to hold gaskets in place during reassembly and is easy to use. Again, not much is necessary.

Man, everyone here is so helpful. I appreciate the tip. I wasn't going to use gasket cement as I'm not sure that's a great thing since it hardens, the plan was permatex gasket sealant only, not the make a gasket stuff. Something like so Advance Auto Parts - Down for Maintenance

 

[DocDoom]

This is crucial to not stripping out the threads in the case and not having a leak imo.
Not sure if it was mentioned but it is a good idea to trace the new gasket on card board and as the cover screws come out, put them in the proper spot on your newly made template. There are different length screws and this will keep them in order, assuring they go back in the proper hole.
Taking lots of pictures as each piece comes off. This will help everything go back the way it came out. Like this.....

Thank you!

 

[DocDoom]

I agree that you can often skip the gasket sealer, assuming things are smooth and not irregular or gouged, but it doesn't hurt anything to use a thin skin on the gasket, both sides.

Another product I sometimes use instead of a room-temperature vulcanizing compound/gasket cement is water-soluble gel like KY. It helps to hold gaskets in place during reassembly and is easy to use. Again, not much is necessary.

Just as an aside, what is the logic for yanking the boss spring and half plate on a mostly stock setup? Just a little more clutch? Less chatter? IDK the tolerances on the spring whether it'd be tighter with it or not. Finding a seven pound torque wrench is fun, might as well understand why this common mod minus DD.

 

[Fire-medic]

The half-friction plate acts as an inexpensive and simple clutch chatter solution.

Removing the smaller-width friction plate and replacing it with a full-width friction plate adds a bit more holding power to the clutch.

If you're older and are fighting arthritic hands, the last thing you need is a stronger to-pull clutch. PCW in Schenectady NY sells a 40% stronger single clutch spring. That's an alternative if you need more holding power, but you're fighting old-age related problems such-as arthritic hands, and you don't want to do the DD clutch because of it.

 

[DocDoom]

The half-friction plate acts as an inexpensive and simple clutch chatter solution.

Removing the smaller-width friction plate and replacing it with a full-width friction plate adds a bit more holding power to the clutch.

If you're older and are fighting arthritic hands, the last thing you need is a stronger to-pull clutch. PCW in Schenectady NY sells a 40% stronger single clutch spring. That's an alternative if you need more holding power, but you're fighting old-age related problems such-as arthritic hands, and you don't want to do the DD clutch because of it.

Gotcha. Yeah, it's new to me so I don't know what to expect in there, could be a Barnett for all I know. Stronger pull is a no thanks, when I start modding it I'll revisit. The plan is if there are two springs, pull one out, then pull the boss and half plate and do as prescribed. If the stock spring isn't doing the job by itself I'll look into the pcw: their webpage is... confusing, I'll give them a call when that time comes. Thanks again.

 

[Fire-medic]

Yes, call PCW, they don't do online well. Some people use two used diaphragm springs, supposedly because they are a bit sagged-out now, and easier to pull than two new ones.

 

[MaxMidnight]

Just as an aside, what is the logic for yanking the boss spring and half plate on a mostly stock setup? Just a little more clutch? Less chatter? IDK the tolerances on the spring whether it'd be tighter with it or not. Finding a seven pound torque wrench is fun, might as well understand why this common mod minus DD.

Short answer - none.
Provided the plates are well within the wear limit you won't notice any difference in clutch performance.
What you will notice is a more clunky gear change and likely a rattle from the clutch when in neutral.

IMO the OE clutch is satisfactory for what it is intended. On my bike I did start to get some slipping even thought even though the friction plates were within spec...just. (Without any evidence) I suspect the full plate and DD mod on a standard bike are done to mask the root cause of slipping.

If you are increasing the power output then that is a different matter.

 

[DocDoom]

Hey everyone, new to the forum but long time lurker. I got the max about a year ago, had a huge amount of work done to it, and all is right in the world, minus the clutch.
Somewhere amidst a lengthy stop and go beach cruise it stopped putting any significant power to the ground, so I think it's due for some new plates. This only happens when hot, engine kind of spins up without catching traction.

I'm writing this mostly to aggregate the parts in one place and see if I'm doing anything way wrong. I have never cracked it, idk what's in it. If the DD mod is present because my clutch sucks I'm removing it. If anyone wants mt to video it for youtube in a way that isn't really old, I can do that.

If the wire is there I will yank it and replace the last friction half plate with a full one.

Using this for reference:
2002 Yamaha V-MAX (VMX1200P) Clutch | Yamaha Sports Plaza

Plate seat (5) and spring cushion seat (6) stay with this wire removal and full plate insertion right?
7 is the half plate to be yoinked along with (4)
Does (8) stay in there? 26H-16324-10-00 or is it removed with the new plate addition (I assume it stays). Should I get a new one?

Parts list otherwise
Gasket, Crankcase Cover part number: 3JP-15462-01-00
from:
2002 Yamaha V-MAX (VMX1200P) Crankcase Cover 1 | Yamaha Sports Plaza

Quantity 2-3 lets be honest.

Plate, Friction 3 (quantity 7+1=8): part number
26H-16307-00-00
From: 2002 Yamaha V-MAX (VMX1200P) Clutch | Yamaha Sports Plaza
Plate, Clutch 1 (quantity 6): Part number 26H-16324-10-00
from:
2002 Yamaha V-MAX (VMX1200P) Clutch | Yamaha Sports Plaza

1. Open it up without warping, yank em. Scuff the new steels and soak with new friction plates.
2. Remove piano wire thing, remove clutch plate (8) and remove half steel.
3. Reinsert full width disc (if not replacing spring and cushion) then plate 8, then alternate friction and steels until complete.
4. Use torque wrench to torque to spec properly with star pattern.
5. Apply super thin layer of gasket sealant to gasket and put it back together.
6. Profit

Is this all fair? I was thinking about replacing clutch fluid after this, but maybe not, see how it goes for a bit.
Thank ya'll so much.
Ken

Some dude on YouTube removed the plate seat (6) when adding the full. I don't see that advice anywhere here so that's why I asked.

 

[CaptainKyle]

Another good link with pictures. Lvlhead's Vmax - Into The Clutch

 

[DocDoom]

Another good link with pictures. Lvlhead's Vmax - Into The Clutch

Yes, I checked that one out and will definitely be using it. My confusion was the terminology vs what is in the manual/diagrams. It turns out after really digging into the forums and asking around that basically the 2 metal things behind the half plate must go(the cushion spring is semi-intuitive the plate seat not so much). More or less everything but the steel behind the wire and then all of that gets replaced with a full plate against the basket. I'll try to take some photos of the job as well and post em.

 

[one2dmax]

When we install the full friction in place of the half friction these are the parts no longer used

 

[Fire-medic]

Thanks for mentioning that Sean.

 

[DocDoom]

When we install the full friction in place of the half friction these are the parts no longer used
View attachment 91348
View attachment 91349

I appreciate it. I've been taking videos and photos of the job, started yesterday. Everything seems pretty straightforward except the gasket was old enough to buy beer so soon enough I'll finish plastic scraping and get everything back together.