Son of a *****!RELAY???WTF???

[GREEN light BLITZ]

HEEEELLLLPPPPP!

I need my Max ASAP. I went to start it.This i exactly what happens and and what I tried and my theory.Please help me ID the problem.

(my theory)
I believe its my starter RELAY...

(what happened)
I turn the key,carbs prime bla bla bla.All the electrical works perfectly.I hit the starter button and NOTHING. The lights dim and the oil light lights up until i release the button.The same thing EVERY time.THERE IS NO CLICKING FROM THE SILINOID AT ALL.

(what I tried)
-I checked the "main fuse" connected to the starter for continuity and it was fine so the fuse is good.
-I jumped the silinoid with a screw driver and it turned over the starter no problem.
-I cleaned the contacts on the starter silinoid and put it back in.
-I pulled in the clutch,put it in gear,put up the kick stand and ALL COMBOS of the above.
-I flipped the kill switch back and forth then took it apart and cleaned it.

Can anyone confirm that its my relay?Please? Or at least your theory...

 

[KJShover]

remove the starter relay and check for voltage on the starter relay's socket when the ignition switch is in the start position and press the button. If there is power, the problem is probably the relay.

 

[GREEN light BLITZ]

That seems like a pretty solid test.The one the manual suggests looks like a reciepe for gettin your hand shocked...Ill try this first thing in the morning before searching for a new relay.
THANK YOU KJ,youre always a good help.

If anyone else has any ideas feel free to throw them out there,Ill be checking frequently.

 

[KJShover]

It's also possible that your solenoid is sticking as well. I'd put a volt meter on it to see what kind of power your getting to the starter.

 

[Buster Hymen]

Take a quick look inside the Start button as the contacts in there are famous for getting dirty and breaking down.

 

[gamorg02]

Take a quick look inside the Start button as the contacts in there are famous for getting dirty and breaking down.

if that was the case, wouldn't the oil light NOT come on and the headlight would stay on?

 

[broook]

If it started when you crossed the solenoid terminals nine chances out of ten the solenoid is your problem.
Sometimes they will just stick and a good tap will fix it but to be safe I would look for another one. The contacts inside could be starting to burn.
A solenoid by the way is just a fancy switch.

 

[Rhoy Carter]

On my 85 Vmax when I pull the turn signal fuse all the safety switches are bypassed.
Try removing the turn signal fuse and see if the starter works.

 

[GREEN light BLITZ]

Can I use the relay from a 1985 Venture Royal? Is it the same and will it work? The people at the local bike place want $75 for the V-Max one special ordered and they want $45 for the Venture relay and its in-stock.

Maybe Sean would know?Im surprised he has not chimed in yet.

 

[KJShover]

I just checked the part numbers that they are the same for a 85 Vmax and an 85 Venture royale.
Starter relay solenoid switch - OEM pt# 36Y-81940-00-00

The following link shows fitment of the part and damn that got passed around.

http://www.oldbikebarn.com/Yamaha-V...axePaNqNe34Pa38Ta38Lbxb0?sc=12&category=74413

 

[GREEN light BLITZ]

My only concern is that my current relay has 2 TINY nuts on the bottom where Ive circled.Not sure if this is the same and you just cant see them or if its ganna be the difference. Guess my best bet it take the old one with me when I go to buy the new one.:confused2:

The rubber is peeled off of mine (i think) is the difference...

 

[KJShover]

My only concern is that my current relay has 2 TINY nuts on the bottom where Ive circled.Not sure if this is the same and you just cant see them or if its ganna be the difference. Guess my best bet it take the old one with me when I go to buy the new one.:confused2:

The rubber is peeled off of mine (i think) is the difference...

I have a feeling that your going to be just fine.

 

[GREEN light BLITZ]

Gotta love it, I call "Chapparal" and "Malcolm Smith" and both tell me for the starter relay its ganna be $75 and it will need to be ordered and it will be here in a few days...

I call and ask about the relay for a 85 Venture Royal and look! They have it in stock and its only $45.

Amazing what a quick cross-refference can do.

 

[one2dmax]

Or used from me would have been about $50 with shipping and I have them on hand. Can't tell from the fiche but not sure the venture unit will work??

Sean

 

[KJShover]

Can't tell from the fiche but not sure the venture unit will work??

Sean

They share the same part number, from what I could find.

 

[one2dmax]

Depends on the year. 85-89 are one kind (with a single activation wire) and the 90 and up vmax uses a 2 wire setup. The 90 venture one I looked a the picture of did not look the same as the older version.

Sean

 

[GREEN light BLITZ]

SOOO...We've narrowed it down...

My ignition (the key portion) had been going out.Thats no question. IT IS DEAD(but can be jiggled and started until now)
I believe this to be the issue. I think the ignition is shorting some place and not running full power to the starter/relay and its finally bad enough to prevent starting it.

I bought the new relay...They wont let me return it but at least i know thats not the problem.

Side note...not sure if mine is set up differently than any others but mine has the one wire on the underside but 2 bolts.
The Venture relay I bought looks exactly the same so I just pulled the 2 wires off that came with it and put on my one.Looks EXACTLY like the original so I think its ganna work out just fine.Probably because the years were the same,85 Max 1200 and I bought an 85 Venture Royal 1200 relay.

As soon as I get paid they will order my new ignition and I can have it done by the weekend I hope. Has anyone else had this problem and it was caused by the ignition?

SYMPTOMS: one day all is well and the bike runs ****!

The next day the key turns and no lights or power,I juggile it and it turns on.

The key gets worse and has to be jiggled till the lights come on but then could be started.

The key now has to be jiggled and all electrical functions work properly when you hit that "sweet spot" and it powers on.

As soon as you hit the starter button the oil lights comes on until you release the button and that is ALL it does.

(jumping the relay to turn it over works so its not the starter or silinoid but wont start it due to the lack of spark I assume)
Do you think it possible the key going out could isolate on one function (such as starting) like this?Either way I need the part but to my knowledge its the ONLY thing on my bike that is wrong.Until the key went bad it ran and started beautifully and that is the only thing that has become a variable.:confused2:

Man this is enough to piss off the pope!:bang head:

 

[gleno]

SOOO...We've narrowed it down...

My ignition (the key portion) had been going out.Thats no question. IT IS DEAD(but can be jiggled and started until now)
I believe this to be the issue. I think the ignition is shorting some place and not running full power to the starter/relay and its finally bad enough to prevent starting it.

I bought the new relay...They wont let me return it but at least i know thats not the problem.

Side note...not sure if mine is set up differently than any others but mine has the one wire on the underside but 2 bolts.
The Venture relay I bought looks exactly the same so I just pulled the 2 wires off that came with it and put on my one.Looks EXACTLY like the original so I think its ganna work out just fine.Probably because the years were the same,85 Max 1200 and I bought an 85 Venture Royal 1200 relay.

As soon as I get paid they will order my new ignition and I can have it done by the weekend I hope. Has anyone else had this problem and it was caused by the ignition?

SYMPTOMS: one day all is well and the bike runs ****!

The next day the key turns and no lights or power,I juggile it and it turns on.

The key gets worse and has to be jiggled till the lights come on but then could be started.

The key now has to be jiggled and all electrical functions work properly when you hit that "sweet spot" and it powers on.

As soon as you hit the starter button the oil lights comes on until you release the button and that is ALL it does.

(jumping the relay to turn it over works so its not the starter or silinoid but wont start it due to the lack of spark I assume)
Do you think it possible the key going out could isolate on one function (such as starting) like this?Either way I need the part but to my knowledge its the ONLY thing on my bike that is wrong.Until the key went bad it ran and started beautifully and that is the only thing that has become a variable.:confused2:

Man this is enough to piss off the pope!:bang head:

This has happened to me and this is what the problem was.

Remove the ignition switch.

The base of the switch is a fibre resin board with the wiring loom contacts connected to it on soldered tabs.

That assembly can be removed by undoing the screws on the nylon base plate of the metal case that houses the assembly. When this is done the board will fall out.

In side you will find that there is a spring loaded contact that acts as the electrical jumper when you turn your key in the ignition barrel.

The following could be wrong.

1. Dirty or corroded contacts.
2. The spring loaded (one spring each side), copper jumper contact is broken. This was my problem. Metal fatigue caused one side of the contact to fracture and the spring pressure was only applied to the jumper by one of the sprung sides giving me an intermittent, jiggly ignition.
3. Wire contact broken.

I have photo's of the dis assembly and fault. I'll see if I can find them and post them here.

Found them. Here they are.

 

[johnpclynch]

Also check your neutral light and sidestand switch. If the bike thinks you're in gear or the sidestand is down then it won't let you start it

 

[GREEN light BLITZ]

My neutral light works fine,I tried putting the kick stand up and down but I should look more into the sending unit itself...

GLENO: I pulled the ignition and cleaned the contacts.It did not work but the copper contacts look VERY worn. Keep in mind my Max is an 85 so there is a fair chance it just wore out regularly.
Did yours do the same thing as far as the oil light coming on and nothing else happening when it happend to you?

Thanks for all the feedback guys. Just having some other feedback has really helped calm me down about the dissapointment of all this.Finally get it lookin sweet from my import parts and then cant ride it.Typical. Should be fixed soon though.