Carb or Electrical??

[[email protected]]

Today was my first ride since last weekend. Last weekend I put in 162.5 mains, added a second set of shims onto the stock needles. It was getting better and better. Last thing I did was turn the a/f screws out a quarter turn each. Jump ahead one week to today

Got to play with the bike and go for a ride today. Before heading out I check the plugs (looked ok) and cleaned them up, put a very light touch of antisieze on the threads, and synched the carbs before heading out for a ride.

Bike seems to be running pretty damn good. Thinking may have everything set where it needs to be after the marks pipes and morley muscle jet kit install.

I fueled up last week, there was 2 miles on the odo when I left today. Made it to my buddy's house to meet up and ride. Had around 25 miles on the odo and ALL OF A SUDDEN..... WTF!!!!! It started backfiring (after firing Chris) out the exhast. Popping. Loading up. Loading up big time. It was running fairly bad and sounds BAD. Lots of popping and backfiring. Sounds like the exhaust outlets are covered, nothing coming out.

Damn. So I decide to go home. Pull the plugs. They look fine, again. Play around to make sure the boots are on good. Take it back out. Same shit. Runs bad. When I wind it up past 6.5K its allright. Then ALL OF A SUDDEN.... It's OK. Not perfect but pretty good. Ran like that for a while. 10 miles or so. Then,... Back to shit. As I brought it home, it was running poorly.

The best way I can describe the feeling is like your riding on a bike whose engine is cold. Its running poorly, loading up, and doesn't take the throttle too good but then when you run it up, it strarts doing OK. But add lots of popping thru the exhaust and the occasional backfire.

It was not running like this when I left the house, it happened all of a sudden. But it got better all of a sudden, but then it started again.

So what would be my best course of action. Shotgun? Check plugs and wire I would imagine also. Other than these things???

So,

 

[davidon]

It could be bad gas/water in the gas. i had a similar problem with sudden power cutting out at speed and then backfiring, and then returning and a repeat of this cycle for a stretch until i put new gas in. Switch to fresh gas asap and add some dry gas in the meantime. Still not 100% sure its the problem (at least for me) it's not carbs and all electrical checks out.

 

[gamorg02]

def check the gas man. easiest solution and is quick to find out if its the problem. drain that shit right out and go get some shell

 

[[email protected]]

Have others had issues with "Bad Gas"?
No, No, not from burritos.....
Ok, anyone else have issues with "bad fuel"?

Hopefully thats all it is. I just can't see it being anything else. Bike is an '06 with 4.5K miles. New fuel filter, (maybe 100 miles on it). Cleaned the carbs two months ago when putting the jet kit in. And has been running fine since all this with the exception of a very slight lean stumble I've been working to get rid of (which seemed to be finally gone after my adjustments made last week)

It is def. running strange. Like I said, if you've ever tried to open up a 2 stroke while it's still cold, that is the feeling. Like it just doesn't want to go, then all of a sudden it'll take off.

Ohmed out the plug wires. From each boot to gnd. Three wires were 22.1-22.6 K Ohms. One was 23.4 K Ohms. Seems a little on the high side but not too high. I don't think? Plugs looked good. Maybe I'll run it for awhile more to get the last of the fuel out and try some different gas. :confused2:

 

[gamorg02]

i would drain the gas completely put some seafoam and fill her up with some good stuff man, don't run anymore thru it than necesary.

copule weeks ago my idle speed was all over the place for a tank. unfortunately i was traveling and can't remember where i got that specific tank from. soon as i ran out of gas and refilled the idle speed stayed on. i also need to synch the carbs tho

 

[ssnsltd]

hmm-
25 five miles into a tank of gas before the issue ? runs fine above 6-6.5k ? bad gas is bad gas- you run like crap, all the time, as soon as it goes in.
kinda doubt it is the gas, but I suppose it is possible.

 

[[email protected]]

hmm-
25 five miles into a tank of gas before the issue ? runs fine above 6-6.5k ? bad gas is bad gas- you run like crap, all the time, as soon as it goes in.
kinda doubt it is the gas, but I suppose it is possible.

Ya, I was riding for a little bit on that tank of gas before the problem hit. And it was all of a sudden. Running fine then BAM. Running poorly. :ummm:.

For some reason I'm thinking spark issue. Just cause I was playing with my plugs not too long before the issue. Maybe just coincidence though?

 

[4gasem]

LOL this happens ALL THE TIME to mine... It usually happens when I HAVE to use ethanol... I found dumping some Techron or Seafoam in the tank and just running it out on the road cleans it up. I also found engaging the enrichment circuit while cruising seems to help. (not sure why)

It happened to me last year... Filled up in Topeka ran it on the dyno and then put it on the truck for a 7 hour ride home... Next weekend I headed out to Anamosa IA for the J&P Cycles open house and BAM! The EXACT same symptoms you are experiencing. I went to the Wal-Mart in Anamosa and bought a container of Techron and dumped it in. Within 30 miles it was running better and after 50 it was fixed.

Chris

 

[[email protected]]

LOL this happens ALL THE TIME to mine... It usually happens when I HAVE to use ethanol... I found dumping some Techron or Seafoam in the tank and just running it out on the road cleans it up. I also found engaging the enrichment circuit while cruising seems to help. (not sure why)

It happened to me last year... Filled up in Topeka ran it on the dyno and then put it on the truck for a 7 hour ride home... Next weekend I headed out to Anamosa IA for the J&P Cycles open house and BAM! The EXACT same symptoms you are experiencing. I went to the Wal-Mart in Anamosa and bought a container of Techron and dumped it in. Within 30 miles it was running better and after 50 it was fixed.

Chris

:biglaugh: Good news. I'm hoping this to be the case.

 

[gamorg02]

where do u guys find non-ethanol gas?

 

[satariel666]

Hi guys.
Little offtop

Im just curious about yours gasoline.
Im PL we have 95 octanes, 98 octans and Shell sels 100 octanes.
From about 1998 they all without lead. Was very toxic before.

Synthetic gasoline is not very popular here, its exist but not commonly used.
Bio Diesel mostly used in farming.

And problems with bad fuel is very often here.
Once i cant get at home from gas station, bike was dead(not v-max) and want fire until fuel was changed.
Symptoms were similar like mabdcmb described but right after, dead completly.

No problems here with my v-max. Tried many diffrent stations and even Chech and German ones. Also no problems with high elevation.
Checked at about 2000m.
I like Shell 100 octane v-power rancing, bike seems more agresivly on it.

 

[4gasem]

From Wiki...

The higher rating seen in Europe is an artifact of a different underlying measuring procedure. In most countries (including all of Europe and Australia) the "headline" octane that would be shown on the pump is the RON, but in the United States, Canada and some other countries the headline number is the average of the RON and the MON, sometimes called the Anti-Knock Index (AKI), Road Octane Number (RdON), Pump Octane Number (PON), or (R+M)/2. Because of the 8 to 10 point difference noted above, this means that the octane in the United States will be about 4 to 5 points lower than the same fuel elsewhere: 87 octane fuel, the "regular" gasoline in the US and Canada, would be 91-92 in Europe. However most European pumps deliver 95 (RON) as "regular", equivalent to 90–91 US (R+M)/2, and deliver 98 (RON), 99 or 100 (RON) labeled as Super Unleaded.
In the United Kingdom, 'regular' petrol has an octane rating of 95 RON, with 97 RON fuel being widely available as the Super Unleaded. Tesco and Shell both offer 99 RON fuel. BP is currently trialling the public selling of the super-high octane petrol BP Ultimate Unleaded 102, which as the name suggests, has an octane rating of 102 RON. Although BP Ultimate Unleaded (with an octane rating of 97 RON) and BP Ultimate Diesel are both widely available throughout the UK, BP Ultimate Unleaded 102 is (as of October 2007) only available throughout the UK in 10 filling stations, and is priced at about two and half times more than their 97 RON fuel.

 

[4gasem]

where do u guys find non-ethanol gas?

Our Shells around these parts are all ethanol based but our BP's all seem to have 87 and 91 with no ethanol and 89 with ethanol so 99% of the time I use 87.

 

[mdix1]

At idle or best there of, does the rpm jump up and down alot? :confused2: If so check ur coils for cracks. My 90 model done it all of sudden also and coils checked good. Had cracks in three of them. Do the cop and c what happens.

 

[[email protected]]

Ok, worked from 4 am till 6:30 PM today. Got home and neither the wife, nor the children were around.... Time to play! So I took the advice of those here suggesting bad fuel. I decide to K.I.S.S. (keep it simple stupid).

:worthy::worthy::worthy::worthy::worthy::worthy::worthy::worthy::worthy::eusa_dance::eusa_dance::eusa_dance::eusa_dance::biglaugh::biglaugh::biglaugh::biglaugh::biglaugh:


I had about 60 miles into this tank of gas. Figure I gotta have about 2 gallons of fuel in the tank then. I had a bit less than half a can of seafoam. The world is in harmony tonight.

I added the seafoam, went for a 25 mile ride around the block. Beat on the bike a lil and it was running GREAT when it was put away. Hopefully this will still be the case next time.

Oh, and the carb settings are feeling pretty good too. with the marks pipes and seans kit I'm currently at a 162.5 main, 2 shims on the needle and 2.75 turns out on the A/F screws (1200' elevation). Gotta buy new plugs and throw em in to check color. The ones in the bike are original.

Thanks all for taming my paranoria and helping me K.I.S.S.

 

[satariel666]

From Wiki...

Thanks.
I do not have access to wiki.us...

 

[TURBOVMAX]

Today was my first ride since last weekend. Last weekend I put in 162.5 mains, added a second set of shims onto the stock needles. It was getting better and better. Last thing I did was turn the a/f screws out a quarter turn each. Jump ahead one week to today

Got to play with the bike and go for a ride today. Before heading out I check the plugs (looked ok) and cleaned them up, put a very light touch of antisieze on the threads, and synched the carbs before heading out for a ride.

Bike seems to be running pretty damn good. Thinking may have everything set where it needs to be after the marks pipes and morley muscle jet kit install.

I fueled up last week, there was 2 miles on the odo when I left today. Made it to my buddy's house to meet up and ride. Had around 25 miles on the odo and ALL OF A SUDDEN..... WTF!!!!! It started backfiring (after firing Chris) out the exhast. Popping. Loading up. Loading up big time. It was running fairly bad and sounds BAD. Lots of popping and backfiring. Sounds like the exhaust outlets are covered, nothing coming out.

Damn. So I decide to go home. Pull the plugs. They look fine, again. Play around to make sure the boots are on good. Take it back out. Same shit. Runs bad. When I wind it up past 6.5K its allright. Then ALL OF A SUDDEN.... It's OK. Not perfect but pretty good. Ran like that for a while. 10 miles or so. Then,... Back to shit. As I brought it home, it was running poorly.

The best way I can describe the feeling is like your riding on a bike whose engine is cold. Its running poorly, loading up, and doesn't take the throttle too good but then when you run it up, it strarts doing OK. But add lots of popping thru the exhaust and the occasional backfire.

It was not running like this when I left the house, it happened all of a sudden. But it got better all of a sudden, but then it started again.

So what would be my best course of action. Shotgun? Check plugs and wire I would imagine also. Other than these things???

So,

If it happens again... Sounds like you may have some crap in one of your carbs. You'll need access to a compressor or you buy a can of compressed air at a computer store. You will have to re-sync your carbs after this, but it's worth a try. Turn the A/F screw all the way in on cylinder your working with and while your doing this count the turns so you can return it to it's original position once your done. Completely remove the screw and blow some air into the screw hole, this may dislodge whatever is choking that circuit in the carb. Don't go crazy with the air just short bursts. Sometimes you can actually isolate the cylinder by feeling how hot a particular cylinder is. The cooler one being the culprit. Or by pulling plug wires and listening to the tone of the engine.

Take it for a ride and see if the problem goes away. If it does... you should pull the carbs and give them a good cleaning. The reason your bikes ok after 6500 is that your now running on the main jets that have no obstruction.

Good Luck! It's not bad gas

 

[[email protected]]

If it happens again... Sounds like you may have some crap in one of your carbs. You'll need access to a compressor or you buy a can of compressed air at a computer store. You will have to re-sync your carbs after this, but it's worth a try. Turn the A/F screw all the way in on cylinder your working with and while your doing this count the turns so you can return it to it's original position once your done. Completely remove the screw and blow some air into the screw hole, this may dislodge whatever is choking that circuit in the carb. Don't go crazy with the air just short bursts. Sometimes you can actually isolate the cylinder by feeling how hot a particular cylinder is. The cooler one being the culprit. Or by pulling plug wires and listening to the tone of the engine.

Take it for a ride and see if the problem goes away. If it does... you should pull the carbs and give them a good cleaning. The reason your bikes ok after 6500 is that your now running on the main jets that have no obstruction.

Good Luck! It's not bad gas

Thanks for the tips Gary. One question though. When you say remove a plug wire, can I do that with the engine running and just leave it hang with no plug in the boot? I have always heard it was bad to unlug the wire and leave it hang unless you have a spark plug in the end and the plug is grounded to the bike. I have no reasoning behind this thought other than I have hear it somewhere?

 

[4gasem]

I've done a complete cleaning of my carbs and then run into this... Not sure why it does it, but mine has 3500 miles on it, is like new and still does it... I always use seafoam during storage so who knows... It's always RIGHT after a fill up of Ethanol.

Chris

 

[TURBOVMAX]

I've done a complete cleaning of my carbs and then run into this... Not sure why it does it, but mine has 3500 miles on it, is like new and still does it... I always use seafoam during storage so who knows... It's always RIGHT after a fill up of Ethanol.

Chris

Chris,

I've had similar problems with fuel... who knows what they put in fuel now a days. Never used Seafoam. The problems I had are usually after a long winter and using something like Store and Start. Remember once cleaning my carbs late fall and spring time just having the bike run terrible. When I disassembled the carbs for cleaning I found this awful looking shmegma in the bowls figured there had been some sort chemical reaction with the Store and Start used for winter storage and the fuel. Now I just top off the tank come winter, try to start it once in a while and hope for the best. Maybe the ethanol breaks up the shmeg and clears the mix.

Think in mambcmb's case the give away is that the bike ran good up in the r's which is where the main jets work. (bigger holes) Could be wrong but that trouble shoot with the air works pretty good at clearing things up.