Possible bad starter-clutch. Confirm?

[hurleyman77]

Got on Ugly to go to work this morning and he wouldn't start :-(

I just got a whirring sound accompanied by a clatter, but the engine wouldn't turn (except for once or twice). So I came here to look for info and ran across a thread that said NEVER try to start on a low battery because it'll make the clutch on the starter go bad by loosening its screws. Sure enough, I had an electrical problem a while back and did a lot of attempting to start with and without a good battery. (But I've been riding every day for the last 3 weeks since then, so I'm not sure that makes sense).

1) Any chance this is what it sounds like when the clutch goes bad on a starter (whir, clatter, no engine turning)?

2) Is it cheaper (possible) to replace just the clutch? Or should I replace the whole starter?

 

[davesax36]

You only need to replace the starter clutch if the starter motor still turns. Doing the clutch is more of a pain than just the starter, though.

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[hurleyman77]

Should have checked the clutch screws when I had the stator cover off two weeks ago >:-(

 

[hurleyman77]

Welp... looks like that wasn't the problem after all... or I didn't fix it correctly. The screws were definitely loose, so I re-installed them with some red lock tight and it started great the first time, but the second time it did the same thing and almost didn't start.

So either something else is wrong, or the damaged threads at the top of the screws is causing more of a problem than I thought.

 

[sdt354]

The screws are a pain to keep tight. I would inspect the threads and see is they are dinged up. They often are from moving around when loose. They can be staked on the ends, or I prefer to weld them and grind the welds flush. This will be the end of this problem for a long time.
Steve-o

 

[hurleyman77]

The threads were pretty banged up near the head of each screw. Would that cause the problem to persist even after they've been tightened?

 

[srk468]

The threads were pretty banged up near the head of each screw. Would that cause the problem to persist even after they've been tightened?

Yes, the bolts are also peened in so anytime you remove them you need new bolts. Use red locktite and repeen them after they are torqued.

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[hurleyman77]

DANG IT!!! I'll have to pull it apart AGAIN. That's frustrating... especially because I probably won't be able to reuse the gaskets again.

It seems like it'd be better to replace those screws with ones that have a shoulder on them, instead of threads all the way up. Any reason not to do that?

 

[alorio1]

Replacing banged up screws is probably not going to fix your problem unless they are loose. Usually the cage that holds the springs and rollers crack which is hard to see and has to be inspected very closely to detect the crack. If your cage is not cracked you might want to order new springs rollers and pins. That should fix your problem unless the sprocket gear that the starter clutch locks onto has worn spots in it and not perfectly round.

 

[hurleyman77]

I'm not totally certain, but I don't think any of those is the problem. I tested the clutch before I put it back together and it seemed to turn freely one direction and grab really well turning the other direction (not sure if my puny arms can adequately simulate a starter motor's torque). All of the springs and rollers seemed to move freely, and I didn't notice any damage (though I didn't look at the cage very closely, which sounds important).

I'm willing to believe that the damage was subtle enough that I overlooked it, but I just hate the idea of opening it back up AGAIN (3rd time) because I'm most likely going to have to wait for ANOTHER set of gaskets... and all just for a diagnosis.

...alas, that may be necessary.

 

[hurleyman77]

Yup, it was totally the clutch, and the clutch cage was cracked all the way through. It didn't help that the springs were also a lot weaker than the springs on the new clutch I put in.

Now it starts like a champ ;-)

 

[alorio1]

I'm happy, happy, happy for ya........hurleyman.......