grinding, clickity, kih-kih-kih-kih sounds on start

ninjaneer · Apr 4, 2011

So don't know what's up. Just rebuilt the carbs if that has anything to do with anything. I turn on the ignition, flip the kill switch to RUN, listen for the fuel pump and v-boost system to complete, and choke the carbs. i then press the START button and grinding, clickity, kih-kih-kih-kih sounds come from somewhere in the front on the left-hand side. i wait a couple secs and then press the START and Maxxy revs to life, no probs after. What the hect is going on? is it the starter? spark plugs? not enough air/fuel mix? :confused2:

mabdcmb@yahoo.com · Apr 4, 2011

Starter clutch!
hopefully you just need to tighten up the bolts. Do a search. Plenty of info

CaptainKyle · Apr 4, 2011

ninjaneer said:
So don't know what's up. Just rebuilt the carbs if that has anything to do with anything. I turn on the ignition, flip the kill switch to RUN, listen for the fuel pump and v-boost system to complete, and choke the carbs. i then press the START button and grinding, clickity, kih-kih-kih-kih sounds come from somewhere in the front on the left-hand side. i wait a couple secs and then press the START and Maxxy revs to life, no probs after. What the hect is going on? is it the starter? spark plugs? not enough air/fuel mix? :confused2:

You need to make sure you battery is really good first & make sure your voltage is not dropping off a bunch when you hit the starter button. If that is good then your starter clutch may be taking a dump.

ninjaneer · Apr 4, 2011

RaWarrior · Apr 4, 2011

Don't worry, it's not that big of a deal. Here's the sparknotes version...

-Remove left peg and shifter
-Remove middle gear and stator covers. Either drain the oil to facilitate this, or find a way to lean the bike on it's right side.
-Remove the big bolt in the middle of the flywheel.
-Go to autozone and rent the "harmonic balancer puller" aka crow foot puller. It should come with a few sets of grade 8 bolts, one of them will fit the vmax's flywheel holes.
-Torque puller down hard, smack bolt with big hammer. Repeat until the flywheel pops off. Maybe have a towel in front, since sometimes they kinda fly off of there.
-On the back of the flywheel, you'll see the big starter gear ring. Carefully pull it out.
-There's three hex head bolts that hold the clutch ring on. Inspect the ring for cracks or breaks. Most likely the ring is loose and undamaged though. The "kih kih kih" is it grabbing, slipping, grabbing again. Remove the three bolts, clean the oil off of them, apply loc-tite. I used the red stuff since I didn't want to bother with it again. Put them back in. Tighten securely.
-Slip the ring gear back into the pucks. It should freely turn one way but not at all the other
-Put flywheel back on. Ensure ring gear meshes with the reduction drive. Put bolt back in.
-Put covers back on. Probably gonna need new gaskets.

Done. Removing the flywheel is the toughest part. It wasn't bad on my bike(maybe 5 min of tightening/smacking) but other people have spent days trying to pull it so who knows.

Mine still misses every so often when it's cold outside....I actually took it apart again to see if it loosened back up but it hadn't, so I guess that's just how it is.

gamorg02 · Apr 5, 2011

RaWarrior said:
Don't worry, it's not that big of a deal. Here's the sparknotes version...

-Remove left peg and shifter
-Remove middle gear and stator covers. Either drain the oil to facilitate this, or find a way to lean the bike on it's right side.
-Remove the big bolt in the middle of the flywheel.
-Go to autozone and rent the "harmonic balancer puller" aka crow foot puller. It should come with a few sets of grade 8 bolts, one of them will fit the vmax's flywheel holes.
-Torque puller down hard, smack bolt with big hammer. Repeat until the flywheel pops off. Maybe have a towel in front, since sometimes they kinda fly off of there.
-On the back of the flywheel, you'll see the big starter gear ring. Carefully pull it out.
-There's three hex head bolts that hold the clutch ring on. Inspect the ring for cracks or breaks. Most likely the ring is loose and undamaged though. The "kih kih kih" is it grabbing, slipping, grabbing again. Remove the three bolts, clean the oil off of them, apply loc-tite. I used the red stuff since I didn't want to bother with it again. Put them back in. Tighten securely.
-Slip the ring gear back into the pucks. It should freely turn one way but not at all the other
-Put flywheel back on. Ensure ring gear meshes with the reduction drive. Put bolt back in.
-Put covers back on. Probably gonna need new gaskets.

Done. Removing the flywheel is the toughest part. It wasn't bad on my bike(maybe 5 min of tightening/smacking) but other people have spent days trying to pull it so who knows.

Mine still misses every so often when it's cold outside....I actually took it apart again to see if it loosened back up but it hadn't, so I guess that's just how it is.

had u thought about replacing the rollers/ring gear ryan? maybe that would fix it up?

ninjaneer · Apr 5, 2011

so it spun gravel only a couple times yesterday before i took it out for a joyride. now each time i try to show my wife, it "works" first time--even after it sat overnight. is this an inconsistent or intermittent problem (like it only happens from time to time)?

RaWarrior said:
Either drain the oil to facilitate this...

hmmm, i had drained the oil on my last job which left maxxxy dry for a couple weeks. could this have contributed to the symptoms? like the oil hadn't properly been distributed throughout? i don't know enough yet about this area of the motor, yet....or motors in general

RaWarrior said:
-Torque puller down hard, smack bolt with big hammer. Repeat until the flywheel pops off....Removing the flywheel is the toughest part. It wasn't bad on my bike(maybe 5 min of tightening/smacking)

so to remove the flywheel i torque "lefty-loosy" or "righty-tighty" when i smack it? and how hard do i smack it? as hard as i smack my wife's ***? :rofl_200: or "Stone Cold Steve Austin" hard.

dannymax · Apr 5, 2011

ninjaneer said:
so it spun gravel only a couple times yesterday before i took it out for a joyride. now each time i try to show my wife, it "works" first time--even after it sat overnight. is this an inconsistent or intermittent problem (like it only happens from time to time)?

hmmm, i had drained the oil on my last job which left maxxxy dry for a couple weeks. could this have contributed to the symptoms? like the oil hadn't properly been distributed throughout? i don't know enough yet about this area of the motor, yet....or motors in general

so to remove the flywheel i torque "lefty-loosy" or "righty-tighty" when i smack it? and how hard do i smack it? as hard as i smack my wife's ***? :rofl_200: or "Stone Cold Steve Austin" hard.

Uh....rather not go there but a little heat around the bolt hole will help a lot.

Redbone · Apr 5, 2011

dannymax said:
Uh....rather not go there but a little heat around the bolt hole will help a lot.

Not sure where this post is going now?
Would this product be enough heat?
It is warming and a lubricant!
There is also a liquid which might get into the cracks better.

:biglaugh:

gamorg02 · Apr 5, 2011

ninjaneer said:
so it spun gravel only a couple times yesterday before i took it out for a joyride. now each time i try to show my wife, it "works" first time--even after it sat overnight. is this an inconsistent or intermittent problem (like it only happens from time to time)?

hmmm, i had drained the oil on my last job which left maxxxy dry for a couple weeks. could this have contributed to the symptoms? like the oil hadn't properly been distributed throughout? i don't know enough yet about this area of the motor, yet....or motors in general

so to remove the flywheel i torque "lefty-loosy" or "righty-tighty" when i smack it? and how hard do i smack it? as hard as i smack my wife's ***? :rofl_200: or "Stone Cold Steve Austin" hard.

when you pull the flywheel you need a puller and it will press against the crankshaft so you will keep making it tighter.

make sure you use one with really good bolts. can rent them from autozone but i snapped a bolt in my flywheel making a good amount of mess and had to use a 3jaw puller. i have an 8ton which works (i got mine off with it) but its a bit big so it makes marks on the back of the flywheel which i'd lend you for the cost of shipping, but you might have better luck borrowing one from autozone (and its free).

dannymax · Apr 5, 2011

Redbone said:
Not sure where this post is going now?
Would this product be enough heat?
It is warming and a lubricant!
There is also a liquid which might get into the cracks better. :biglaugh:

I was afraid of this happening............:rofl_200:

RaWarrior · Apr 5, 2011

The oil shouldn't have anything to do with it skipping. The instant the motor starts oil's getting flung all over the place in there.

You torque the puller normal right-to-tight. I used a mini-sledge, probably a 2 or 3lb hammer to smack the bolt. I mean don't so ape **** on it, but a good, solid, smack.

Gannon I suspect new "pucks" might fix it, but honestly it's such a slight issue I can't be bothered. Once summer breaks it'll never happen once, and even in dead of winter cracking the gas ever so slightly seems to "fix" it, so whatever. If it starts to get worse I'll replace them, but otherwise I'm just gonna leave it....not broken so it doesn't need fixing.

ninjaneer · Apr 5, 2011

Thanks everyone! So I'm pretty sure now, that what my problem is is in fact a starter clutch issue. I watched the "vmax starter clutch kaput" video on youtube and aside from theirs sounding like a rock bouncing around in the casing, whereas mine sounds like a bag of loose gravel, the whirring and what-not is exactly what my Max is suffering with.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hDUKb7JbzZE
I've got a brand spanking new battery so I don't think that that's it, but I'll go put a multimeter on it just to completely rule it out instead of assuming. As I read more of the different posts, I'm gaining more confidence with my ability to do this (but although it looks relatively straight forward, everyone makes it look so easy, and if this ends up just like my other jobs, it's gonna take me three times the effort hahahahaha)

So what are y'all's opinion on this: Permanent solution for starter clutch problems? Overkill? Obviously there is a significant cost difference, but is the cost-to-benefit ratio just as significantly favorable? how 'bout the cost-to-peace-of-mind ratio? is just replacing and tightening and peening the stock setup just as good at ~$20 vs the modernization at ~$300? How long will the $20 fix last before I have to revisit versus the $300 upgrade?

gamorg02 · Apr 5, 2011

RaWarrior said:
The oil shouldn't have anything to do with it skipping. The instant the motor starts oil's getting flung all over the place in there.

You torque the puller normal right-to-tight. I used a mini-sledge, probably a 2 or 3lb hammer to smack the bolt. I mean don't so ape **** on it, but a good, solid, smack.

Gannon I suspect new "pucks" might fix it, but honestly it's such a slight issue I can't be bothered. Once summer breaks it'll never happen once, and even in dead of winter cracking the gas ever so slightly seems to "fix" it, so whatever. If it starts to get worse I'll replace them, but otherwise I'm just gonna leave it....not broken so it doesn't need fixing.

i follow.. i'm garrett tho. 88vmx12 is gannon

gamorg02 · Apr 5, 2011

ninjaneer said:
Thanks everyone! So I'm pretty sure now, that what my problem is is in fact a starter clutch issue. I watched the "vmax starter clutch kaput" video on youtube and aside from theirs sounding like a rock bouncing around in the casing, whereas mine sounds like a bag of loose gravel, the whirring and what-not is exactly what my Max is suffering with.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hDUKb7JbzZE
I've got a brand spanking new battery so I don't think that that's it, but I'll go put a multimeter on it just to completely rule it out instead of assuming. As I read more of the different posts, I'm gaining more confidence with my ability to do this (but although it looks relatively straight forward, everyone makes it look so easy, and if this ends up just like my other jobs, it's gonna take me three times the effort hahahahaha)

So what are y'all's opinion on this: Permanent solution for starter clutch problems? Overkill? Obviously there is a significant cost difference, but is the cost-to-benefit ratio just as significantly favorable? how 'bout the cost-to-peace-of-mind ratio? is just replacing and tightening and peening the stock setup just as good at ~$20 vs the modernization at ~$300? How long will the $20 fix last before I have to revisit versus the $300 upgrade?

if you could swing the $300 i would do it. i think sean has all the parts available. i didn't have the extra $290 to do it (only needed 3 bolts as mine had JUST started) acting up.

alorio1 · Apr 5, 2011

I would take it apart, pull the flywheel, inspect for loose screws and if they aren't losse get with Sean Morley and let him hook you up with what you need. He is a site supporter and thats what make this site available to us. He is always here on the forum or at the shop to answere any questions you have, he's hard to beat and you will never get the run around dealing with him....just my .02 cents

RaWarrior · Apr 5, 2011

gamorg02 said:
i follow.. i'm garrett tho. 88vmx12 is gannon

Whoops lol how did I mess that up...

gamorg02 · Apr 5, 2011

RaWarrior said:
Whoops lol how did I mess that up...

not sure. plus you've met me, and i dont' think u've met gannon!

ninjaneer · Apr 7, 2011

gamorg02 said:
...but i snapped a bolt in my flywheel making a good amount of mess...

when i first read this a couple days ago, it didn't cross my mind to understand what "mess" meant. but now I know. i just read your ordeal. HOLY CRAP! i hope to dear god i don't have the same experience.

gamorg02 · Apr 7, 2011

ninjaneer said:
when i first read this a couple days ago, it didn't cross my mind to understand what "mess" meant. but now I know. i just read your ordeal. HOLY CRAP! i hope to dear god i don't have the same experience.

yup. makes me shudder. i had a hell of a winter.

if i could do it all over again, i would *probably* skip the whole crow foot puller and go get the right size 3 jaw puller and use that. those jaws are a lot less likely to stretch that sub-par bolts. the haynes manual actually suggests using a '2-jaw puller' if you look at the pics in the manual

here is the right size one you'd want:

http://www.tractorsupply.com/tools/...rhand-6-in-gear-puller-2-frasl-3-jaws-3835276

also a good 1 1/4" (i believe as it actually fits better than 32mm and those are hard to find) wrench to hold the flywheel. tractor supply has those too

grinding, clickity, kih-kih-kih-kih sounds on start

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