2009 Service Manual - Yamaha Factory Parts Diagram Discrepancy

[Chris C]

So. The 2009 Service Manual for VMX17Y(C) calls out THE CRANKSHFT POSITION SENSOR as a potential point of failure for the ignition system and electronic fuel injection system in particular. On pages 8-132 and 8-133 it talks about how to test that component and what specific resistance it should have (192-288 ohms).

And yet, on ALL the parts diagrams for all the parts places that I can find "on the internet", there is no such sensor called the CRANKSHAFT POSITION SENSOR that I can order should mine be faulty. Further, there is no reference to a CAMSHAFT SENSOR in the 2009 manual, yet there is a callout on DIAGRAM 1 ELECTRICAL for a CAMSHAFT SENSOR on the parts sites.

What's the deal?

cam position sensor 18 (on Electrical Diagram 1 of parts place)
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Crankshaft position sensor in the Manual page 8-119 #12

 

[Itgoes]

Check here in the Parts Manual:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/9cw2nsu54rhysv7/vmx17yb_ycb parts.pdf?dl=0

 

[Itgoes]

Looks like the crankshaft sensor is part of the stator assembly?

I would look over the connector/coupler near the fuel tank very closely before replacing anything.

 

[Chris C]

Thank you. I will locate the coupler post work and see what is what.

 

[Chris C]

Everything checked out. Traced the leads. Did my tests. Plugs are firing. Timing is happening. No fuel, but I can smell it. Time to trace the lines. Is there an inline filter on gen 2's?

 

[Itgoes]

Chris, what's the history of the bike? Did you just buy it.....has it ever run for you?

What codes are you getting now?

 

[Chris C]

History....had a 92 Gen 1. Sold it after my 2nd child. Waited. Bought this 2016 Gen 2 in 2018 with 1600 miles on it from Texas. It was originally a California bike....has the canister etc. It was essentially brand new from my perspective. This is my 1st fuel injected bike....all carbs b4. It has driven well, although there were signs that what is happening now was going to happen.

It ran a little hot. It would just stall out while waiting at a stop light but start back up. Yes, I synced the throttlebodies....which is interesting. I have noticed a little lag in the acceleration as of late. It has been harder to start. Idle could be a little bit rough initially, but nothing that indicated bad news.

3 weeks ago I drove it to my German club. I am pres of a 700 member cultural organization in Cinci that is 50 years old now. Cool place that reminds me of my grandparents. I drove there with no issues. It started. It did all the Vmax things it was supposed to do. I even ran it out on a stretch of empty road. Got to the parking lot, put it in neutral, shut it off and put the stand down. Went to my finance meeting. 4 hours later I came back and tried to start it. It would almost fire, but wouldn't. Heavy light colored smoke came out of the exhaust smelling of unburnt fuel. It started but I had to stay on the throttle for 5 minutes until it stopped coughing and ran. I road it home. It would not start after that.

There are no codes. It is clean. There were 2 in history but I know where they came from....kickstand down, slip in the grass caused an "angle" issue. I also tested all the things you can in diag mode. I don't see or hear anything wrong.

I changed the plugs ...all 4 indicate rich run.... coolant, brakes because I was already there, brake fluid... Checked the fuel pump by putting a hose on it and turning it on... pumped gas into a gas can no problem. I have looked at all the electrical connections, fuses ...new battery fully charged... I finally got a spark tester....plenty of spark. I smell a little gas, but after removing the air filter and plenum I can see no gas is going to the throttle bodies. Now that I know that, I can probably figure it out, but I said that 3 weeks ago. I feel like I need a certificate from Enzo Ferrari to work on this thing. Small spaces, big hands, 9 miles of wiring and, to complete my whining, the simple fuel, electricity, compression, air that my dad taught me seems a lot harder on this bike.

 

[Itgoes]

Is it stock? No Power Commander or other fuel controller installed?

 

[Chris C]

Stock

 

[Chris C]

I'm starting to feel like I need to pump all the gas out of it and go buy 3 gallons of premium....just to start with knowns... and probably some starter fluid....

 

[Chris C]

Yamaha has released several very informative maintenance videos on YouTube.... like this one:
Fuel Injection Testing

 

[Chris C]

1st test of fuel pump pressure......42lb. Spec is 47 and the manual says it actually runs higher. Given the fuel pressure gauge is a Heinous Fright (Harbor Freight) gauge I just bought, it could be off. But if not.....holy cow a fuel pump is expensive. As soon as the pressure subsides, I am testing again.

Fuel pump
Pump type Electrical
Maximum consumption amperage 6.5 A
Output pressure 324.0 kPa (3.24 kgf/cm², 47.0 psi)

 

[Chris C]

So, when the bike is trying to start, the pump runs all the time because the injectors are draining off pressure. I assume that is also the case when the bike is running. When the pump is running, the pressure is 50 lbs. When maximum pressure is reached and pump shuts down, it immediately drops to 42 lbs and stays there for a while.

I sprayed some starter fluid down the throttlebodies. It tried to start. I am encouraged.

 

[Itgoes]

So it almost sounds like the injectors aren't firing but you should have a code for that. Also doesn't make sense that you smelled heavy fuel while trying to start the bike, because that sounds more like a spark issue.

I'm assuming you checked the fuel injection fuse?

 

[Itgoes]

So it almost sounds like the injectors aren't firing but you should have a code for that. Also doesn't make sense that you smelled heavy fuel while trying to start the bike, because that sounds more like a spark issue.

I'm assuming you checked the fuel injection fuse?

Have you looked at the TPS and APS values in the diagnostics mode? One of those sensors being bad could cause a non-start issue.

 

[Itgoes]

Pretty sure this is the Fuel Injection Fuse. Under side cover on right leg side of bike.

 

[Chris C]

great guess. Nope. That was the first stuff that I checked....because unlike the rest of the bike, that fusebox is fairly easy to get to.

 

[Chris C]

no codes. Injectors are firing....diag makes them each click 5 times. I no longer smell gas. I am wondering if, just because they fire in diag doesn't mean they are firing in run mode because they aren't getting a signal.

 

[Chris C]

Is there a way to get the ECU to use its default fuel map rather than close loop? Can that be forced?

 

[Chris C]

Finally got around to testing the stator today after working another 60hr week. There are 3 legs on the stator for vmax and since mine won't start it had to be a static test. Manual says to test resistance as 1:2, 1:3, and 2:3. In each test, the resistance should be between : Stator coil resistance 0.184–0.276 Ω at 20 °C (68 °F) (manual). I don't have a 2 decimal ohm meter...yet, but the readings I am getting are .6 for each leg....over twice the resistance. I am not sure if that means the stator is bad, but the manual says replace it. Wondering why it would be up that high across all 3 legs. I guess I'll find out when i remove it.