85 Max - pre purchase - what to look out for?

[Shuriken]

Hi everyone,

I'm new to the forum but not to bikes. I have 5 other rides right now and some experience wrenching on them and other things. I've had my eye on the Max since the 90s and am in the process of buying an 85 model right now.

I have owned various Yamaha XS11s and an XS650 as well and a lot of my experience there transfers over. I have also been snooping around using the search function and have learned quite a bit. I do have a service manual as well.

I would like some advice on what to check out on the 85 max that will help me decide if I should purchase it. For example, I know most of the tips and what to look for as it relates to bikes in general, but I'd like to know what to look for on the Max.

On the XS and the Max, I know to watch out for tranny issues, as they tend to shred 1st and 2nd gears, clutches, etc. The XS sometimes has middle and final drive issues if not maintained, etc.

Concerning this Max's good points (as far as I can tell with a cursory inspection):
Well under Blue Book Value
Around 30k miles on the clock
Decent seat
Decent exhaust
Seems to pull quite strongly once it's on the mid range carb circuits

The bad:
Crappy, non OEM paint
Fork Seals
Brake Pads
Front tire
Clutch and Brake handlebar master cyls look terrible but seem to function well
Stainless clutch line seems to be weeping at the joint by the left foot peg
Carb issues

I plan to immediately check the oil for any ominous signs. I have already ridden the bike to know it sputters and coughs at idle, but as soon as I feel the bike is safe enough to test ride it again, I plan to romp on it in 2nd gear to see if the tranny is OK.

I don't hear any out of place engine or tranny noise, so I'm hoping that if the oil checks out OK and if I don't have tranny issues, I'll make the purchase and deal with the carb and other wear and tear issues and TLC as I have time, as I already have painting equipment, carb synch, multitester, and other tools.

Is there something else I should be looking for in terms of determining how sound the engine and tranny are on an 85 Max?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Tom_Owens]

The main thing you have to consider is this:

You're buying a 23 year old bike. She's more than likely going to have some issues.

From what you've described so far, it sounds like someone threw some slipons and a stage kit in it, but never had the carbs properly tuned. There's enough post around this site that can walk you through that. Barring that, there's deffinately enough brain power and experience on this site to help you get that sorted.

I'll be bold and say this: The "Crappy aftermarket paint" and the "nice exhaust but constant sputtering" would tip me off that anything done to that bike was done in a half-assed fashion. Otherwise, it wouldn't be crappy, would it?

My buddy John has an '85 max that he rides to absolute death, and it STILL looks and runs good. He knows he's due for a rebuild, but the bike still runs out damn well.

I would also do one other thing: Ask him if you can change the differential oil on your dime. Go out and get some good rear end oil and do it yourself. Check out that drain plug and the oil.

That can tip you off big time about how well the bike has been kept up with...more so than the engine oil in my opinion.

Even a blockhead will change the engine oil once in a while, especially if he's selling the bike. He might not even consider (and may have NEVER considered) the rear end.

Also, take a good look under the fake tank. He shouldn't object to you doing so. You're just being thorough. See if it looks 'half assed'. You'll know the instant you see it if it is.

If you start getting a little bit uneasy after all of that, walk away and look at other Maxes.

In fact, check this site out. There's almost always someone selling one or someone that knows someone that is selling one.

One more side note: A VMOA member sold his '85 Max a few months ago. He kept that bike up better than he did his house. He LOVED that bike. 6 months after he sold it, one of the cylinders let go. Keep in mind this is a 23 year old bike. The guy that bought it got all bent out of shape over it and the seller was terribly upset and offered half the guys money back.

I told him no way. You buy something used, you take your chances. Who's to say what that guy did to burn that cylinder?

Just be careful. Personally, unless you're like one of these real pro's up here that can build a Max in their sleep, I'd try to find myself a newer model Max to deal with.

My two cents.
Tom

 

[Rusty McNeil]

I would buy the newest one you can afford.

The new models have better front forks, better front brakes, fewer tranny issues (the 85" were notorious I heard) and better ignition system.

The main thing for me would also be the "cosmetics" Old age can be hard on a bike and it's tough and expensive to address all those "little things" that make a bike show it's age even when it's perfect mechanically.

Rusty

 

[Shuriken]

Thanks for the replies Tom and Rusty.

I changed the oil today and didn't find any shiny garbage in there, thank goodness. I will check the final drive oil later today. I also checked and aired up the tires and checked some other things.

Though running rough, I was able to get it through the gears on a safe patch of straight road earlier. She pulls pretty hard and v-boost seems in order, and it didn't pop out of any gears on me.

So.... Now I want to check the pilot circuits and spark plug color and see what's going on with these carbs.

And you're right, cosmetics are very expensive. I bought 2 XS11 motorcycles in the past for apparently less than what it costs for a new V-Max exhaust!

 

[Rusty McNeil]

Thanks for the replies Tom and Rusty.

I changed the oil today and didn't find any shiny garbage in there, thank goodness. I will check the final drive oil later today. I also checked and aired up the tires and checked some other things.

Though running rough, I was able to get it through the gears on a safe patch of straight road earlier. She pulls pretty hard and v-boost seems in order, and it didn't pop out of any gears on me.

So.... Now I want to check the pilot circuits and spark plug color and see what's going on with these carbs.

And you're right, cosmetics are very expensive. I bought 2 XS11 motorcycles in the past for apparently less than what it costs for a new V-Max exhaust!

When you check the tranny you might also want to try deccelerating in every gear at different speeds also to see if it pops out. I don't know about the Vmax but I've had other bikes that they started popping out of gear when doing that before they got so bad they starting falling at when accelerating.

Just a thought

Rusty

 

[gleno]

Hi everyone,

I'm new to the forum but not to bikes. I have 5 other rides right now and some experience wrenching on them and other things. I've had my eye on the Max since the 90s and am in the process of buying an 85 model right now.

I have owned various Yamaha XS11s and an XS650 as well and a lot of my experience there transfers over. I have also been snooping around using the search function and have learned quite a bit. I do have a service manual as well.

I would like some advice on what to check out on the 85 max that will help me decide if I should purchase it. For example, I know most of the tips and what to look for as it relates to bikes in general, but I'd like to know what to look for on the Max.

On the XS and the Max, I know to watch out for tranny issues, as they tend to shred 1st and 2nd gears, clutches, etc. The XS sometimes has middle and final drive issues if not maintained, etc.

Concerning this Max's good points (as far as I can tell with a cursory inspection):
Well under Blue Book Value
Around 30k miles on the clock
Decent seat
Decent exhaust
Seems to pull quite strongly once it's on the mid range carb circuits

The bad:
Crappy, non OEM paint
Fork Seals
Brake Pads
Front tire
Clutch and Brake handlebar master cyls look terrible but seem to function well
Stainless clutch line seems to be weeping at the joint by the left foot peg
Carb issues

I plan to immediately check the oil for any ominous signs. I have already ridden the bike to know it sputters and coughs at idle, but as soon as I feel the bike is safe enough to test ride it again, I plan to romp on it in 2nd gear to see if the tranny is OK.

I don't hear any out of place engine or tranny noise, so I'm hoping that if the oil checks out OK and if I don't have tranny issues, I'll make the purchase and deal with the carb and other wear and tear issues and TLC as I have time, as I already have painting equipment, carb synch, multitester, and other tools.

Is there something else I should be looking for in terms of determining how sound the engine and tranny are on an 85 Max?

Thanks in advance.

I owned an XS1100E for many years and now own an '88 max which has mostly been refurbished.

If I were you I would do the following things to the '85 and make note of these before you buy.

Before you buy, do the basics.

Pull the plugs and check them out to determine if they are ok and how the combustion chambers have been functioning.
Is there any tappet noise in the top end (do shims need adjusting).
Do a compression test. This will tell you if the motor is still tight.
Check the oil to see if it is correct grade and colour. (has it been getting changed?)
Take off the radiator cap. What colour is the coolant?
Look at the colour of the brake and clutch fluid. Is it normal?
What is the colour. Consistency and fill level of the diff oil?
Put it on the centre stand, start it up and put it into gear (2nd) what does the diff and driveline sound like? Any rattles, knocks or excess chatter?
Check the swingarm for play. And see if the rear wheel bearing is firm. Front wheel bearing check for play. While on the centre stand let it idle until its HOT. Check for coolant leaks and make sure you instruments work.
Have a look at the battery. Are the cells full? Is there any evidence of mineral deposits on the battery terminals or the cell plates?

These give good insight into how well the bike has been maintained and the general condition of the mechanicals.

Now because you do not know the last time any component on the bike was replaced you should count on doing the following ASAP if you buy the bike.

1) Replace all rubber components on the bike. With a bike of this age the rubberized components are either shot or at the end of their service life. By replacing them all at once your tear it down once and everything can be maintained predictably from that point. Otherwise you will be fixing oil leaks, coolant leaks brake & clutch fluid leaks etc every other day.

You should replace the following rubber;

a)All coolant lines that are rubber and any seals used in the coolant system. Check the coolant drain cock valve because this little bit of plumbing corrodes much quicker than the rest of the system. Check the water pump for coolant leaks. These usually show up as tell tale white deposits on the external engine cases underneath the water pump cases. (it?s dried coolant). The pump seals are ceramic and rubber and will be very brittle and worn. Obviously you would then flush the cooling system, pressure test and use fresh coolant. Now you don?t have to worry about blowing a hose in the middle of peak hour or on a distant highway and cooking the motor. Make sure the thermo switch is working.
b)Brake & clutch hoses. Brake and clutch master cylinder seals and plungers (recon kit). Slave clutch kit. Brake calliper seals and pads (unless you are replacing the callipers all together.) Fresh fluid of course.
c)All external engine oils seals e.g. gear shift selector arm, clutch push rod and drive shaft.
d)All front suspension oil seals, dust seals and fork tube guide bushes. Replace the air suspension o-rings seals.
e)Check and or replace the rear suspension rubber mounting bushes. Replace is cracked or hardened.
f)Replace the tyres and tyre valves, front and back regardless.
g)Replace all paper caskets on the cases that have been removed for inspection.

2) You should replace some metal parts ASAP as well.

a)Swing arm bearings.
b)Steering head bearings. VERY IMPORTANT.
c)Front and rear wheel bearings.
d)Check the clutch plates for wear and replace if necessary.

3) You should refresh some electrical components.
a)Buy and install a fresh battery.
b)Replace all fuses and bulbs.
c)Clean and reconnect all ground connections to the frame and engine

4) Fuel system needs attention.
d)Replace all flexible fuel lines from tank to pump to carbs.
e)Remove and clean carbs. This means strip and clean. Replace all rubber o-rings and all gaskets and seals.
f)Replace the seals in the idle circuit and the choke plunger.
g)I the rubber boots forming any part of the inlet manifold are cracked or rock hard, replace them.

When you start this way the bike just needs routine maintenance as per the service manual from that point on. Very little will go wrong with it.

Now you know the true costs associated with purchasing an ?88 V-max.



All you have to do now is select a colour and paint it. :thumbs up:

 

[113s&s]

i would not buy anything that old except a house.......

 

[Dreamster66]

i would not buy anything that old except a house.......

I've had a few issues with my 85, but I don't regret for 1 second buying it!

 

[KevinFL]

I own a '85 & a '93. Owned em since new. My '85 had a recall for the trans wich had problems with 3rd gear. Other than that, it has been dead reliable. It has 20k miles & is in showroom condition. In '93 the Max got bigger brakes & larger fork tubes. Past 88 I think the ignition is solid state as well. If like restoring motorcycles, the '85 is a historical bike. Otherwise I would look for a '93 +.

 

[Rusty McNeil]

I owned an XS1100E for many years and now own an '88 max which has mostly been refurbished.

If I were you I would do the following things to the '85 and make note of these before you buy.

Before you buy, do the basics.

Pull the plugs and check them out to determine if they are ok and how the combustion chambers have been functioning.
Is there any tappet noise in the top end (do shims need adjusting).
Do a compression test. This will tell you if the motor is still tight.
Check the oil to see if it is correct grade and colour. (has it been getting changed?)
Take off the radiator cap. What colour is the coolant?
Look at the colour of the brake and clutch fluid. Is it normal?
What is the colour. Consistency and fill level of the diff oil?
Put it on the centre stand, start it up and put it into gear (2nd) what does the diff and driveline sound like? Any rattles, knocks or excess chatter?
Check the swingarm for play. And see if the rear wheel bearing is firm. Front wheel bearing check for play. While on the centre stand let it idle until its HOT. Check for coolant leaks and make sure you instruments work.
Have a look at the battery. Are the cells full? Is there any evidence of mineral deposits on the battery terminals or the cell plates?

These give good insight into how well the bike has been maintained and the general condition of the mechanicals.

Now because you do not know the last time any component on the bike was replaced you should count on doing the following ASAP if you buy the bike.

1) Replace all rubber components on the bike. With a bike of this age the rubberized components are either shot or at the end of their service life. By replacing them all at once your tear it down once and everything can be maintained predictably from that point. Otherwise you will be fixing oil leaks, coolant leaks brake & clutch fluid leaks etc every other day.

You should replace the following rubber;

a)All coolant lines that are rubber and any seals used in the coolant system. Check the coolant drain cock valve because this little bit of plumbing corrodes much quicker than the rest of the system. Check the water pump for coolant leaks. These usually show up as tell tale white deposits on the external engine cases underneath the water pump cases. (it?s dried coolant). The pump seals are ceramic and rubber and will be very brittle and worn. Obviously you would then flush the cooling system, pressure test and use fresh coolant. Now you don?t have to worry about blowing a hose in the middle of peak hour or on a distant highway and cooking the motor. Make sure the thermo switch is working.
b)Brake & clutch hoses. Brake and clutch master cylinder seals and plungers (recon kit). Slave clutch kit. Brake calliper seals and pads (unless you are replacing the callipers all together.) Fresh fluid of course.
c)All external engine oils seals e.g. gear shift selector arm, clutch push rod and drive shaft.
d)All front suspension oil seals, dust seals and fork tube guide bushes. Replace the air suspension o-rings seals.
e)Check and or replace the rear suspension rubber mounting bushes. Replace is cracked or hardened.
f)Replace the tyres and tyre valves, front and back regardless.
g)Replace all paper caskets on the cases that have been removed for inspection.

2) You should replace some metal parts ASAP as well.

a)Swing arm bearings.
b)Steering head bearings. VERY IMPORTANT.
c)Front and rear wheel bearings.
d)Check the clutch plates for wear and replace if necessary.

3) You should refresh some electrical components.
a)Buy and install a fresh battery.
b)Replace all fuses and bulbs.
c)Clean and reconnect all ground connections to the frame and engine

4) Fuel system needs attention.
d)Replace all flexible fuel lines from tank to pump to carbs.
e)Remove and clean carbs. This means strip and clean. Replace all rubber o-rings and all gaskets and seals.
f)Replace the seals in the idle circuit and the choke plunger.
g)I the rubber boots forming any part of the inlet manifold are cracked or rock hard, replace them.

When you start this way the bike just needs routine maintenance as per the service manual from that point on. Very little will go wrong with it.

Now you know the true costs associated with purchasing an ?88 V-max.



All you have to do now is select a colour and paint it. :thumbs up:

Great post

 

[Redbone]

I would buy the newest one you can afford.

The new models have better front forks, better front brakes, fewer tranny issues (the 85" were notorious I heard) and better ignition system.

The main thing for me would also be the "cosmetics" Old age can be hard on a bike and it's tough and expensive to address all those "little things" that make a bike show it's age even when it's perfect mechanically.

Rusty

Agreed! I bought a 1992 with just 4300 miles on it, from the original owner for $3500. It runs great, but as Rusty mentioned above, those things needed updating.
Mine needed to have the seat redone (mine is on way back from Sean of Morley's Muscle as I type this), needed body parts repainted (sun faded, minor scratches, and paint chips), the clear coating needed to be redone on the valve covers, wear spots on the crankcases, some rust on the metal bits.
Of course this allows you to update, mod, personalize your new purchase into the bike that fits you. By the time I'm done with this years mods I will have spent almost as I paid for it! But for under $7g I will have a Vmax that looks the way I want it to, stop the way it should, handle the best it can and be reliable as a new bike.

 

[gleno]

Of course this allows you to update, mod, personalize your new purchase into the bike that fits you. By the time I'm done with this years mods I will have spent almost as I paid for it! But for under $7g I will have a Vmax that looks the way I want it to, stop the way it should, handle the best it can and be reliable as a new bike.

....and that is exactly why I would buy it. This is where the enjoyment, reward and satisfaction come from.

 

[Robbarrie]

How many owners has this bike had ?
If it's $1000 or less. I'd might go for it, especially if your handy and you think it's in pretty good shape after you give it a good going over.

On the other hand, having that $1000 towards a newer one is better than saving up an extra grand.

Go with your gut, that's all that matters. What ever he's asking, don't buy it for that ! But, in the end if you get burned, you'll know better next time won't you - it's happened to all of us at one time or another : pehaps with a car/snowmachine/4 wheeler ect. At that age, if it wasn't A-1 shape or very cheap....thinking I'll use it for parts later on. I'd look else where.

 

[one2dmax]

It's very hard to buy a vmax that is complete and RUNS for under $2500-$3000 for ANY year.

It sounds like if it is under KBB/NADA then it is a probably a decent buy (depending on how much under). I occassionaly find people hurting for money and get good deals on them then either part them out or clean them up and sell them (usually fix them up).

Sean Morley

 

[Shuriken]

Thanks everyone for your replies.

I think that if I can continue to be confident in the tranny and engine, I'll get the bike. Although like Gleno pointed out, most of the things on the bike will probably need and will get attention, there can be satisfaction in "saving" a forlorn Max.

I haven't seen a lot of Max's in my area. There are plenty of v-twin cruisers and colorful zip splats, but very few brute power cruisers like the XS, V-65, and V-Max. I missed out on a used Max last summer at the Yamaha stealership that went for about $6k. So I think I'll pick this one up and refurbish it.

In my experience buying and repairing other bikes, I would generally start out with a basket case and work on things over time, increasing in expense as the bike proved its worth. I think this is OK if a guy plans to keep the bike. Seems you can never get back what you put into them.

It would be great if this 85 Max is or can be made to be as reliable as my XS11's have been, though. I know quite a few people who claim to have put over 100,000 on their XS without any major repairs.

 

[Robbarrie]

I wasn't suggesting that every 85 is worth a $ 1000. I hope nobody takes it that way. I need to clarify that. Prices are based on age, condition, miles, mods and the class of bike it is. However, If a bike has been beat - it's done and like anything it's then only good for parts.

I had an 72 Chevelle - at the time I sold it - $1500. Now, it would be worth I bet 5 times that.
I hope everything works out well for you. If your happy that's all that counts. Post some pics when you get it. Congrats. :clapping: and welcome.

 

[gleno]

"colorful zip splats" :rofl_200:Now that's funny :clapping:

 

[Shuriken]

I purchased the bike.

And today I spent the whole day with the carbs. Took everything apart, cleaned, inspected, dried with compressed air, reinspected, and reassembled. Took me insane amounts of time and various cursings to get the throttle cables reconnected. Bar none the worst part of the whole job.....

Jetting appears to be stock. All rubber diaphragms - main and also small ones - appear to be in good order. Float bowls were decent (I was expecting to see rust from the gas tank in the bowls). I spent $25 bucks replacing various screws on the carbs and also replaced the intake manifold rubber caps.

I set the mix screws at 2.5 turns out and reassembled the airbox assembly. The airbox boots won't fit very nicely over the carb bells, which I'm sure is causing issues.

The bike fired up on choke. Runs with 1/2 the amount of choke it used to require before the carb cleaning. Was able to get it to idle anywhere from like 200-1000 rpm, but only with some choke. Throttle is much better.

So, at this point, I still have to use choke or it won't idle but I'm pretty confident in the carb cleaning and I can tell it's running better. But I think one existing problem is the airbox boots. Can you get replacement airbox boots anymore? Should I just get individual filters?

I think this thing will really go once I sort out the idle. Any help is appreciated.

Thanks

 

[gleno]

If the boots are leaking their is no way you will get this thing to idle predictably.

You can pinpoint the leak by spraying some engine starter fluid around the boot seals and see if you get any change in engine rpm.

Sounds like you may have an air leak somewhere if you have to enrich the mixture with choke to keep it idling.

BTW : The V-max will start and idle even with the carb slides removed.

If you have had the carbs out and apart you will also need to resynch the carb slides.

 

[Shuriken]

Agreed. That's why I need to know if I can just replace the airbox boots or if I have to come up with some other ideas.

I also have a Morgan Carbtune Pro. Nice tool. Will synch the max carbs shortly.