clutch problems(barnett)??? 1st gen vmax

[mzbk2l]

Rebuild of the slave cylinder is pretty quick and easy, especially with it already removed. I think I paid around $10 for a generic kit on ebay and it solved my minor clutch engagement issues.


Do you have a brake cylinder hone?

 

[vmax1998]

Rebuild of the slave cylinder is pretty quick and easy, especially with it already removed. I think I paid around $10 for a generic kit on ebay and it solved my minor clutch engagement issues.


Do you have a brake cylinder hone?

No I do not have a brake cylinder hone


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[Fire-medic]

Looks clean, no leak I'd say.

 

[vmax1998]

Looks clean, no leak I'd say.

Ok then I’m going with it’s the master cylinder


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[Fire-medic]

'Clean & dry' I should have said. Maybe something w/the master cyl.

 

[Wrinkled Wrider]

My guess would be that the hydraulic pressure is not being fully relieved after the clutch has been used on a ride. The clutch would be under pressure if the drain back is slow and gradually increase until it would simulate a continuous pull by the rider -- bad news for any clutch.

One way to check would be to measure the amount of lever travel for disengagement after serial uses.

 

[vmax1998]

So replaced the clutch boss and put everything back together. The whole clutch. The slave cylinder and I also rebuilt the master cylinder. So everything is back together. Been bleeding the clutch for hours. No matter how many times I bleed it the clutch is still super soft and I am getting absolutely no clutch engagement whatsoever. I could pull the lever in with my pinky. This is super frustrating. I’ve vacuum bled it and it pulls air and fluid out and I’ve ran 2 bottles of brake fluid through it. If I manual bleed it a little fluid comes out but no air at all. Which makes no sense to me. This is really frustrating as I haven’t rode in over a month because my bike has never worked properly. I need some ideas on why it’s not bleeding and why the clutch doesn’t have any feel to it. At this point I just want to take it to a bike mechanic. I’m tired of throwing money at it and spending all my free time trying to figure out what’s wrong. If anyone knows a mechanic in the Phoenix AZ area that would be able to come look at it or something that would be great.


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[jdeitz1979]

So replaced the clutch boss and put everything back together. The whole clutch. The slave cylinder and I also rebuilt the master cylinder. So everything is back together. Been bleeding the clutch for hours. No matter how many times I bleed it the clutch is still super soft and I am getting absolutely no clutch engagement whatsoever. I could pull the lever in with my pinky. This is super frustrating. I’ve vacuum bled it and it pulls air and fluid out and I’ve ran 2 bottles of brake fluid through it. If I manual bleed it a little fluid comes out but no air at all. Which makes no sense to me. This is really frustrating as I haven’t rode in over a month because my bike has never worked properly. I need some ideas on why it’s not bleeding and why the clutch doesn’t have any feel to it. At this point I just want to take it to a bike mechanic. I’m tired of throwing money at it and spending all my free time trying to figure out what’s wrong. If anyone knows a mechanic in the Phoenix AZ area that would be able to come look at it or something that would be great.


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I have a vacuum bleeder and I think it’s more trouble then help sometimes. I’m old school when it comes to bleeding brakes and clutches sometimes. I crack the bleed screw enough to let it gravity bleed, or get an assistant to help run the lever while running the screw. I could see the frustrations for sure, but that can also lead to something simple overlooked. How full is your master? Did the metal line get a slight pinch in it? Is the slave leaking? With it half full and bleeder closed you should be able to build some pressure, to get where you can bleed it. It sounds like the rod didn’t get put in, or the ball.
I have never had this issue so I can only throw out a guess. If you were in ny I’d definitely give ya a hand. When you did the master, all of the parts got put where they belong? Maybe a oring got a rip?


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[vmax1998]

I have a vacuum bleeder and I think it’s more trouble then help sometimes. I’m old school when it comes to bleeding brakes and clutches sometimes. I crack the bleed screw enough to let it gravity bleed, or get an assistant to help run the lever while running the screw. I could see the frustrations for sure, but that can also lead to something simple overlooked. How full is your master? Did the metal line get a slight pinch in it? Is the slave leaking? With it half full and bleeder closed you should be able to build some pressure, to get where you can bleed it. It sounds like the rod didn’t get put in, or the ball.
I have never had this issue so I can only throw out a guess. If you were in ny I’d definitely give ya a hand. When you did the master, all of the parts got put where they belong? Maybe a oring got a rip?


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I pulled the clutch cover off again and the push rod is in there. I didn’t check to see if the ball was in there because I don’t really want to pull off the pressure plate again. But I know I put the ball in when I reinstalled everything. And I rebuilt the master cylinder exactly how the book said and the slave doesn’t leak. So I don’t know what’s going on. This bike has been a project since I got it. Which isn’t what it was suppossed to be.

I’ve also bled over a bottle of brake fluid through the master cylinder. It’s full now because I filled it and haven’t bled it again yet. I don’t see how the metal line could have a pinch. I also replaced the clutch boss but I did everything by the book so I’m not sure what the problem could be.


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[cwkerr007]

i dont know if this is your problem but my goldwing used to do that same thing and i replaced the master cyl no more prob but just for kicks when you ride it and it starts slipping stop and crack your bleeder loose and see if you have pressure build up go ahead and bleed it and if you have clutch then you know its a hydraulic prob not the clutch

 

[jdeitz1979]

I have my old stock controls. They’re nothing pretty but if you want them just pay the shipping and they’re yours. That’s if you want to rule out the mc but you did just rebuild it.

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[vmax1998]

I have my old stock controls. They’re nothing pretty but if you want them just pay the shipping and they’re yours. That’s if you want to rule out the mc but you did just rebuild it.

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I appreciate it. I don’t know what those controls would do for my issue. I might take the master apart again and make sure I put it together right. I did it to what the manual said but maybe I’ll double check


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[vmax1998]

I tore apart the master cylinder and I did put it together wrong. Just had a rubber piece in the wrong spot. I put it back together correctly and it still won’t bleed correctly and get any clutch movement. So I ordered a slave cylinder repair kit and might as well tear that apart again too just to cover all of the ground.


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[sdt354]

Most similar issues are air bubble related. Gen 1's are notorious for being difficult for some to bleed. Reverse bleeding works for many. I finish using a long piece of clear hose, open the bleeder and pump the lever until I know it's firm and air free. If you get it bled, then the next day it collapses to the bar, it's usually air in the system. Usually.

 

[Fire-medic]

Properly done the reverse-bleed solves all air-entrapment issues. It's quick, and a minimum of fuss. It works better bleeding the clutch side than a traditional pump and open the bleeder valve regimen.

 

[vmax1998]

Properly done the reverse-bleed solves all air-entrapment issues. It's quick, and a minimum of fuss. It works better bleeding the clutch side than a traditional pump and open the bleeder valve regimen.

I’ve tried reverse bleeding it. It doesn’t work. It won’t push any fluid through up to the master cylinder. Just builds a ton of pressure then the hose shoots off my syringe and sprays brake fluid everywhere all over everything


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[Hellion]

If you’re reverse bleeding and the pressure is building up there’s a problem. When you do this the lid for the master cylinder needs to be off. You should see a fountain of brake fluid coming out of the brake fluid. You will need to push the fluid slowly as not to make a large fountain. If you still are building pressure you have a problem with the master cylinder or your clutch line has a build up and not letting the fluid flow back into the master cylinder.


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[Fire-medic]

As my directions said in the slave cyl. replacement, if you don't have flow to the opened master cyl, you have a collapsed hose or a probable total obstruction of crud blocking the master cyl holes in its floor.

You need to disassemble the hoses from the calipers from the splitter block, and from the master cyl-splitter block. Use a rubber tip on an air hose to ventilate each hose in-turn and I bet you find one (or more) is totally-obstructed.

Also use the rubber tip air hose attachment to blow through the small floor of the master cyl hole, with the banjo bolt and hose to the splitter block off, and a piece of paper towel over the threaded end of the banjo bolt hole, to catch anything that blows-out the master cyl end.

One or the other will show you that you have a blockage.

A blocked hose sometimes can be cleared, but if you see the hose blow-up the sidewall like a balloon, or you cannot clear the hose line, throw it away and get a new one.

 

[D-Max2012]

This might be a relevant or not, but here goes..

I recently picked up a set of bleeder screws when I was rebuilding my rear caliper.
I did not realize that the package the guy sold me where "One-Way" bleeder screws.

They're supposed to make bleeding easier, by not allowing air (or anything else for that matter), to be sucked back in, as you release pressure on the grip or pedal. (This supposedly eliminates the need to close the bleeder screw, each time after the compression step of your brake or clutch bleed).

If you happened to have changed your bleeder screw, or have one of those in there, I can see it not allowing fluid back into your system, popping off, and spitting brake fluid all over the place..

Just food for thought..

 

[Fire-medic]

Yes that's a good point, that would prevent you from doing a reverse-bleed. Simply remove the bleeder valve and blow-through the port from the nipple side, where you would be attaching a tubing to bleed traditionally, not the side with the taper, that sits screwed-into the caliper body. If you get no-flow, you have a spring-loaded 1-way bleeder valve. If your flow is full and unobstructed, you have a simple 2-way valve, they type that comes stock and what you need to do the reverse-flush.