Hard down-shifting

[Flyerdon]

I've got a 2005 Max and it runs well, and is in great condition. No issues or problems with the way it runs but it down shifts pretty hard and once in a while it's impossible to find neutral unless I turn the bike off. After turning it off it will drop onto neutral without a problem. When I first got it I thought the clutch might be dragging a bit but because it's a hydraulic clutch I don't see a way to adjust the engagement point. Any suggestions or advice? It has less than 9000 miles and is otherwise a joy to ride.

 

[marsmax85]

what oil are you using ?
if synthetic try using rotella 15w40 t4

 

[caseyjones955]

When shifting gets notchy and N gets a little bit elusive I change oil. Shift quality is how I gauge when my oil is spent enough to warrant a change. I use conventional Rotella 15w 40 but I know blends and full synth are also popular.

 

[Flyerdon]

When shifting gets notchy and N gets a little bit elusive I change oil. Shift quality is how I gauge when my oil is spent enough to warrant a change. I use conventional Rotella 15w 40 but I know blends and full synth are also popular.

I just changed the oil and filter thinking that might be the problem but it is only marginally better. I wanted to get some castrol golden but couldn't find any.

 

[MaxMidnight]

When you downshift do you blip the trhottle to bring the revs up before changing gear.
Have you ruled out clutch drag?
You could try bleeding the clutch (recommend reverse bleeding) to make sure the fluid is in good condition and no air is in the system.
Finding neutral can be an issue, try reducing the tick over speed.

 

[ouchez]

I've got a 2005 Max and it runs well, and is in great condition. No issues or problems with the way it runs but it down shifts pretty hard and once in a while it's impossible to find neutral unless I turn the bike off. After turning it off it will drop onto neutral without a problem. When I first got it I thought the clutch might be dragging a bit but because it's a hydraulic clutch I don't see a way to adjust the engagement point. Any suggestions or advice? It has less than 9000 miles and is otherwise a joy to ride.

On my stock 05 I use Valvoline Motorcycle oil, and when I have that problem I change the oil, 44,000 miles zero problem.

 

[Flyerdon]

This change I used 20w-40 Spectro 4 but I have no idea what the PO was using. He only owned the bike about a year or so and although he said the oil had been changed, it sure didn't look like it. I've used Mobil 1 T4, and I've had 9 Yamaha's over the years from a 1978 or so XS650 to a 2018 FZ09 and although I think Yamaha makes a strong transmission, I can't say most have had an easy shifting transmission. My 2022 Triumph T100 and 2018 Moto Guzzi V7 III have very smooth transmissions, Galaxies apart as far as how they feel going through the gears. This V-Max is by far the roughest one, especially after the bike has warmed up really well. I don't notice the harshness quite so much when the motor is cooler.

 

[Gingerkaren1]

I swear this forum is telepathic! Same issue with my 1999 and was going to ask about it. Changed the oil which was stinkin, PO said it was done (wasn't) so defo was an issue. Used mineral oil and it's better. Might do it again although it was well bled. It's still happening but nowhere near as bad. Only really gotta ride it for any length of time this summer. And dito, only when the bike gets good and hot. The joy's. Running great at the minute though, loving it more every day.

 

[Flyerdon]

Seeing how the down shifting seems to be the real problem I was wondering if the shifting forks or the gears themselves are made slightly different so that moving one way is easier because of the way the machining was done, i.e. a slight slope one way or the other??

 

[Fire-medic]

As MaxMidnight said, try bleeding the clutch (#1) or a total fluid change (#2). That's after the oil change. You did the oil change, time for #1 and/or #2.

If you notice the engagement/disengagement point is coming back closer to the handlebar then you may have a worn master cyl seal, worn slave cyl seal (both are usually going to leak brake fluid through you can also have an internal seal leak) or air in the system.

Watch for fluid leakage under the bike around the left footpeg. That would be the slave cyl leaking.

Your bike should have the 'better' shift star segment of the shift drum. Losing pins from that could cause loss of gear selection capability. It could be one gear, some, or all, depending upon how many segment pins popped-out. Again, your bike should have the better design already and not require changing, assuming it is intact/unworn.

Shift fork issues are usually a high mileage issue. The shift drum can also wear under that type of use, and once apart the wear to either is easily seen. That requires case-splitting. The channels of the shift drum for the shift fork movement, when worn are very evident.

 

[ouchez]

I've got a 2005 Max and it runs well, and is in great condition. No issues or problems with the way it runs but it down shifts pretty hard and once in a while it's impossible to find neutral unless I turn the bike off. After turning it off it will drop onto neutral without a problem. When I first got it I thought the clutch might be dragging a bit but because it's a hydraulic clutch I don't see a way to adjust the engagement point. Any suggestions or advice? It has less than 9000 miles and is otherwise a joy to ride.

When you buy a used MAX you must figure someone may have beat the hell out of it at one time or another, like speed shifting, missing gear, smoking the tire etc. These activities are not healthy for the machine. In My case with my 05 I am the first and only owner and never have I done any of those things I mention, and that may be why I have zero problems with the tranny. I also never do wheelies, hard on forks seals etc.

 

[Flyerdon]

Roger that. Unfortunately, power bikes invite misuse in all too many cases and like you, I treat my bikes like I'll own them forever.

 

[VegasDan]

You need to put new clutch fluid in
Almost a guaranteed fix

 

[Jack Hammer]

All valid points mentioned above. Sometimes the slave cylinder leak is very small. I had that and my slave leaked one drop per 50 pulls on the lever.

One other thing that might be the issue here is a worn clutch basket. Or if you go to the extreme, the center nut loosening. This problem is not only related to downshifting.