Power Commander 5 and Mileage

[guysmax]

Hi guys, can anybody show a photo of the afr map that they are using with a power commander v for gen 2 vmax. A dealer where I purchased the bike set the entire afr map at 13.2. Is there anywhere on the map that can be changed to a leaner afr setting. Thanks

 

[Traumahawk]

Hi guys, can anybody show a photo of the afr map that they are using with a power commander v for gen 2 vmax. A dealer where I purchased the bike set the entire afr map at 13.2. Is there anywhere on the map that can be changed to a leaner afr setting. Thanks

1st question, do you strictly have a PCV, or do you have an autotune as well? On the fuel table for the PCV, it is percentages of fuel.....so you can have a positive 10% of fuel......or even a minus 10% of fuel. If you have an autotune.....that really is the way to go. Then you tell it the A/F that you want........at a certain RPM and throttle percentage. (unfortunately I am at work, and so cant give you screen shots of everything). But.....65-80 on the highway will be between 15 and about 20% throttle position, as well as according rpm......so 3750 to 4500 rpm. So, instead of a percentage, you tell the autotune that you want a 14.0 to a 14.5 in area of that map that governs highway speeds, and it will adjust accordingly.

What I have HEARD, and I dont know the validity. a 1% change in fuel.....will give you a .1 difference in A/F. So a +5% in fuel would drop your present A/F .5......and vice versa. When I got the ECU reflashed......the pod 300 that I have on the handle bars was giving me an A/F of 15.8. Not too lean......but the bike was a little bit down on power. So if you get the bike too lean......you will know it.

So, if you dont have an autotune......do a -5% to -10%, in those areas, and see how the bike responds. I know on my bike with the autotune, it was adding 18, 19, and 20% extra fuel to get it from 15 down to the 13s.

This is a cool video on the autotune.

 

[guysmax]

Thanks traumahawk for your help. I do have auto tune and want to change my cruising speed afr numbers for better fuel economy and send those new numbers to my PCV. Then auto tune can do its thing using my new afr numbers. Thanks again

 

[Traumahawk]

Thanks traumahawk for your help. I do have auto tune and want to change my cruising speed afr numbers for better fuel economy and send those new numbers to my PCV. Then auto tune can do its thing using my new afr numbers. Thanks again

I currently have mine at 14.0 in those areas. I might go 14.2 or 14.5, and see if the bike likes it.

 

[Traumahawk]

I have a question about the power commander 5. I have a reflashed ECU, and I have a PCV to go on it, but havent gotten it installed yet, or tuned. I know that the PCV can be used to fine tune the fuel for max HP, but can it also be used to get the best MPG as well?

This is on a 2011.

Thanks

Just wanted to post up what Ive found. YES, using the PCV and Autotune, you can tune for HP at 100% throttle, and gas mileage at the 20% throttle range. Right now about 33 mpg at 75 and 80 with me an a PAX. Last Dyno was 185 hp and 119 lbs of torque under less than ideal conditions. It was 92 degrees, so a little bit warm in the dyno.....but not bad. There is still a little bit more in it, and have a few more things that I want to try.

One of the best things that I did was to set up the PCV for individual maps in the gears, instead of 1 map for every gear. The fuel requirements are different in each gear.

I do want to give a public shout out to Mark....Itgoes for allowing me to bounce ideas off of.

When people have said that i cant have the best gas mileage that a Gen 2 can make.....and HP.....why not?

 

[Traumahawk]

I currently have mine at 14.0 in those areas. I might go 14.2 or 14.5, and see if the bike likes it.

The trick is setting up the autotune for 14.7. According to Tim Nash, that is where the Gen 2 makes the best gas mileage

Thanks traumahawk for your help. I do have auto tune and want to change my cruising speed afr numbers for better fuel economy and send those new numbers to my PCV. Then auto tune can do its thing using my new afr numbers. Thanks again

If you dont mind me asking, what did you ever find out? I can send you pics of what I currently have set up in the autotune.

 

[user 74794]

I set my afr from 13.2 to 14 and mpg went 28-29 to 34. Never tried leaner

 

[bipick]

I wouldnt worry about fuel economy. One of the fastest bikes ever made. Not top speed of couse... A sixth and seventh gear would fix that though. Carry extra fuel in a bladder, and enjoy all the insane power.
So the bag on the rear seat has a bladder that holds 3.5 gallons. 130 miles to fuel stops running hard in mountains. TUNE FOR POWER! ONE OF THE FEW BIKES THAT DESERVES IT!
I average 18 mpg thru mountains. I don't know if that's good, but it's a cheap thrill compared to anything else I can think of.

Could i get some info on the bladder that you use for extra fuel?

 

[Traumahawk]

This is the one that I have https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07W3F26GF?ref=em_1p_0_ti&ref_=pe_2313370_435109130

and the tailbag that it fits into. Cortech Super 2.0 14 Liter Motorcycle Sportbike Tail Bag | eBay

 

[Dmax1207]

Around here, its fairly easy to get Non Ethanol fuel, and of course that will add mileage.

I think that people are miss understanding me, when I talk about increasing the mileage of a gen 2 Vmax. My viewpoint is....why not? Why cant i have my cake and eat it too? Just because it hasnt been done before, doesnt mean that it cant be done.....or even try. When i went and dynod the 07.....I didnt know what i was doing, but i learned, and I experimented, and the 07 is now perfect.Approx 90 dyno runs will do that. I can crack open the throttle at 2K, with no hesitation all the way to 10K in any gear, and get over 40 mpg, and did it with factory pro needles. (During all of it, i learned how to tune a stage 1 kit.....as well).

To help, I have the PCV, and the Autotune, and the POD 300. Tim Nash is pointing me in the direction of using the AIS system to operate the autotune at various stages, and to turn the autotune off at other stages. That is interesting stuff.

I have NEVER complained about the gas mileage of a Gen 2, but everything can be better, because until you tune something specifically for you, your bikes current configuration, riding style....everything is a compromise.

I'm shooting for 200 RWHP on the 2011. I passed 125 RWHP on the 07, certainly passed that on the 86 (yellow)......132 RWHP (although that is a 1260 and tuned by PCW). The 05 that i have.....is essentially stock. Its more of a test mule

View attachment 70026 Everyone has to have goals.
View attachment 70027 View attachment 70028 View attachment 70029

Traumahawk, I'm playing with the PCV and the autotune for a while now, but it's the first time I heard of switching the autotune with the IAS.... That would be the ideal solution for deceleration..... How did you do that?

 

[Jaketheone46]

I've got to 105 before low fuel light, bone stock 2018. I threw in a K&N and pulled the restrictor out of the air box. But I was riding with my dad on his vstar 650 so I wasn't riding hard at all. Took the pic after I fueled up. Worst I got was 64 miles to fuel light. I could care less what my fuel mileage is, lol. I don't hear the nhra guys/gals complaining about fuel mileage. All with ethanol, I'm not paying $4 a gallon for non ethanol, and I'm only aware of 1 station that sells 93 ethanol free around me. I add a little sea foam like I did in my gen 1. But I can ride year round.

Restrictor in the air box? I wonder if this has been done to mine. What type of restriction is in the air box? I have a lot to learn being new to the vmax.

 

[one2dmax]

Remove the 3 weld rivets as pictured (just drill the heads off) and pull the divertor plate.

 

[Jaketheone46]

Remove the 3 weld rivets as pictured (just drill the heads off) and pull the divertor plate.

Wow that’s going to be an easy one, but why would this be there if it restricts performance I wonder? I also want to see if that plate affects the ram air intake in a good or bad way.

 

[user 74794]

Wow that’s going to be an easy one, but why would this be there if it restricts performance I wonder? I also want to see if that plate affects the ram air intake in a good or bad way.

Being there isn't any ramair on a vmax it isn't going to change it.

 

[Jaketheone46]

Being there isn't any ramair on a vmax it isn't going to change it.

Really?? Wow I had heard on the gen 2 that the air scoops were actually functional?? I’ve been picking bugs out of them every ride. Lol. Are they at all functional or just completely for looks? I can’t understand why they wouldn’t have at least used them as functional air intakes? Mine is completely new to me so I have a lot to learn. Thanks for the info by the way.

 

[one2dmax]

The gen 2 does have functional scoops while the gen 1 did not. The restrictor does help speed up airflow and minimize intake noise (to pass emissions). We don't care if it sounds like it's sucking you in so get rid of it! Nice thing is you can put it back in at any time as well should you want to do that.

 

[user 74794]

Functionality and ram air two totally different things. Just because air goes through and out and around doesn't do crap as far as a performance goes. Taking the scoops completely off the bike would be more of a performance enhancement.

 

[Allen Zielinski]

I have heard that the EPA is now going after the aftermarket tuners. A few years ago the EPA when after Harley Davidson with their Screaming Eagle tuner. The new Screaming Eagle tuner is restricted so that it will only allow you to enrichen to a 14.7 to 1 AFR. At that time the EPA sited that Harley was a manufacturer & was providing a tuner to make their motorcycle non EPA compliant.

With the EPA now attacking the after market tuners I wonder how that will affect the Power Commander?

 

[Butch Cassidy]

I wouldnt worry about fuel economy. One of the fastest bikes ever made. Not top speed of couse... A sixth and seventh gear would fix that though. Carry extra fuel in a bladder, and enjoy all the insane power.
So the bag on the rear seat has a bladder that holds 3.5 gallons. 130 miles to fuel stops running hard in mountains. TUNE FOR POWER! ONE OF THE FEW BIKES THAT DESERVES IT!
I average 18 mpg thru mountains. I don't know if that's good, but it's a cheap thrill compared to anything else I can think of.

Extra fuel bladder..... looks better than anything else ive seen. Info please... thanks

 

[Lil'skeet]

It's s thick fuel bladder and it fits in the tail bag. They're original purpose was for dirt bikes and off-road as it came with a backpack. But my Gen 2 VMAX seems to love it and the fuel that's in it. It's almost like a Camelback bag but on steroids.

https://www.giantloopmoto.com/product/armadillo-bag-liquid-power-reservoir/
When filled, it fits very snuggly in the cortech bag. I will rarely pass up a fuel station when off the beaten path, but it is nice to double my range when needed.