Biker Dash
Well-Known Member
And many in society is making a strong effort to judge, so my point is made as well ^_^
The Supreme Court got it right this time
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And many in society is making a strong effort to judge, so my point is made as well ^_^
caseyjones955
Well-Known Member
Dyslexia does suck but I get by, it slows my reading down a bit but I still managed to get through nursing school with it. I make no excuses but a spelling error can still get me now and then. What really gets my attention is all the grammar and tense errors, there is no way to blame that on anything, not even a thyroid problem.
On the gay marriage thing, I know it offends some people and many consider it wrong, but consenting gay adult couples being able to marry and enjoy equal rights is as important as due process. I understand that religious folks may take great exception to this but the gay folks aren't going to hurt us with this. I even think its important to preserve the rights of those opposed to be able to speak out against it. free speech, rock on with yourselves! What is bullshit is the govt being involved in this in any way at all. It's deplorable to tell anyone that they may not enjoy equal rights because it does not jive with the bible. This is an argument that may always boil on and so be it, diversity is good. I'm only saying that the govt has no business meddling in any of this. Laws against rape, child rape and sexual assault are pretty much enough in all their variations.
On a personal level I resent folks assuming I'm a Christian/Catholic because I'm a nurse. Most atheist nurses are closeted, especially straight white male ones like myself. I respect religious folks and their rights but Goddammit I demand my rights be respected to. We atheists, agnostics and free thinkers are all enjoying our own belief sets, complete with ethics, morals and *possibly* spirituality, but surely not discrimination against those that do not agree with us. We don't need or want biblical values forced on us and DAMN SURE dont want laws to that effect. Let the gay folks do their thing, let us do ours, and you do yours!
See, that was not so hard
unk:
Sorry about the rant, it was not mean to be offensive but more to illuminate other belief sets and respect for all from all. And most importantly that the govt leaves us all alone to do just that.
"Just because I"m not on the same path your on does not mean I'm lost" - cant recall where I heard this one but I really do like it.
On the gay marriage thing, I know it offends some people and many consider it wrong, but consenting gay adult couples being able to marry and enjoy equal rights is as important as due process. I understand that religious folks may take great exception to this but the gay folks aren't going to hurt us with this. I even think its important to preserve the rights of those opposed to be able to speak out against it. free speech, rock on with yourselves! What is bullshit is the govt being involved in this in any way at all. It's deplorable to tell anyone that they may not enjoy equal rights because it does not jive with the bible. This is an argument that may always boil on and so be it, diversity is good. I'm only saying that the govt has no business meddling in any of this. Laws against rape, child rape and sexual assault are pretty much enough in all their variations.
On a personal level I resent folks assuming I'm a Christian/Catholic because I'm a nurse. Most atheist nurses are closeted, especially straight white male ones like myself. I respect religious folks and their rights but Goddammit I demand my rights be respected to. We atheists, agnostics and free thinkers are all enjoying our own belief sets, complete with ethics, morals and *possibly* spirituality, but surely not discrimination against those that do not agree with us. We don't need or want biblical values forced on us and DAMN SURE dont want laws to that effect. Let the gay folks do their thing, let us do ours, and you do yours!
See, that was not so hard
unk:Sorry about the rant, it was not mean to be offensive but more to illuminate other belief sets and respect for all from all. And most importantly that the govt leaves us all alone to do just that.
"Just because I"m not on the same path your on does not mean I'm lost" - cant recall where I heard this one but I really do like it.
85 MAX-fan
Well-Known Member
Here is a question to you all. How much are you willing to work, how many days, weeks or months out of your own lives to pay homosexual couples to be married? How much should government be able to force you to work to pay these people? How much debt should your children be forced to deal with to pay homosexuals that are married?
caseyjones955
Well-Known Member
I'm not aware of any additional expenses gay couples cost society that straight couples don't. Couples that have children are by far biggest burden on taxpayers.
There should be no tax perks, cons or anything for being married. Straight or gay. I maintain that the govt needs to stay out of the whole marriage business and honor separation of church/state.
As long as we're here, how do gay couples cost more than straight couples?
There should be no tax perks, cons or anything for being married. Straight or gay. I maintain that the govt needs to stay out of the whole marriage business and honor separation of church/state.
As long as we're here, how do gay couples cost more than straight couples?
MtnMax/Magniac
Well-Known Member
I would counter that maybe it is not so much an effort to judge, but rather to follow a judgement that HE already made, if you believe HE did.
blaxmax
Well-Known Member
I personally don't believe in HE.
blaxmax
Well-Known Member
dyslexia does suck but i get by, it slows my reading down a bit but i still managed to get through nursing school with it. I make no excuses but a spelling error can still get me now and then. What really gets my attention is all the grammar and tense errors, there is no way to blame that on anything, not even a thyroid problem.
On the gay marriage thing, i know it offends some people and many consider it wrong, but consenting gay adult couples being able to marry and enjoy equal rights is as important as due process. I understand that religious folks may take great exception to this but the gay folks aren't going to hurt us with this. I even think its important to preserve the rights of those opposed to be able to speak out against it. Free speech, rock on with yourselves! What is bullshit is the govt being involved in this in any way at all. It's deplorable to tell anyone that they may not enjoy equal rights because it does not jive with the bible. This is an argument that may always boil on and so be it, diversity is good. I'm only saying that the govt has no business meddling in any of this. Laws against rape, child rape and sexual assault are pretty much enough in all their variations.
On a personal level i resent folks assuming i'm a christian/catholic because i'm a nurse. Most atheist nurses are closeted, especially straight white male ones like myself. I respect religious folks and their rights but goddammit i demand my rights be respected to. We atheists, agnostics and free thinkers are all enjoying our own belief sets, complete with ethics, morals and *possibly* spirituality, but surely not discrimination against those that do not agree with us. We don't need or want biblical values forced on us and damn sure dont want laws to that effect. Let the gay folks do their thing, let us do ours, and you do yours!
See, that was not so hard
Sorry about the rant, it was not mean to be offensive but more to illuminate other belief sets and respect for all from all. And most importantly that the govt leaves us all alone to do just that.
"just because i"m not on the same path your on does not mean i'm lost" - cant recall where i heard this one but i really do like it.
+1
God said it was wrong but you can say it's right?
I guess you think you fill those shoes.
I do pray all the time for you and all that are in the world.
AND I'M NOT JUDGING. you're a homosexual, you want to marry the same sex. I don't hate you. I just don't care for what you want to do.
it's all factual. exactly how is that judging??? the bible says man and woman.
again how does that make me judge? I believe in the bible and family values. you do not. again - it's factual.
85 MAX-fan
Well-Known Member
You do realize that married gay couples now are going to be granted certain social security monies that they previously werent. The same social security system that is broke. That same ponzi scheme that is, and has been, a money in money out 100% scam. Now, a whole new group of people is going to be drawing money off of the government teet. You didnt honestly believe this was because the poor gay community felt left out and sad did you?
How many fraudulent gay mariages are going to be sucking dissability benefits so that they can party on the tax payers backs?
How much of your life are you willing to devote to working to pay for that?
How many of these people are going to flood our courts with devorce proceedings? How much tax money will that take? Your tax money.
As long as we are here how are heterosexual married couples with children a "burden" to tax payers?? Lol....
caseyjones955
Well-Known Member
I dont think anyone should get anything for being married, and those with kids should pay more taxes, not less (I say that and I raised two kids).
Your point is well taken, gay marriages will cost in that regard, but anymore than straight folks?
I think you and I would agree more than disagree. Fraudulent marriages would be completely prevented if there were no benefit from govt.
Let the churches marry folks, let the churches nullify marriage and perform arbitration without using the legal system. It sounds like removal of govt from the marriage business would address both of our concerns.
85 MAX-fan
Well-Known Member
Removal of government would be accomplishing something, not completely ignoring the disaster that is the flood of non existing money being handed out to fragmented groups created and encouraged by politicians. They accomplished nothing but making our debt grow exponentially. People are jumping up and down like some good was created.
Anyone watching Greece? Their dept per person is LESS THAN OURS. The only thing keeping the lie rolling in the US is the government printing more money.
forestdaledave
Well-Known Member
Where do you get your facts? Walmart? Social Security isn't broke. Gay people pay property taxes and produce no children. They pay the same property taxes as people who produce kids, so they are in effect subsidizing the hetrosexual kid's education. The great majority of Gays and Lesbians are not poor. Usually they are very accomplished people with no children costing many dollars to raise. Everyone who had or has children knows the expense. Also what is happening in Greece is not what is happening in the United States. The two are so different they cannot be compared.
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this may help - or not. it stands a it is. you deal with it.
And, if you say there is no GOD that sent his one and only Son to be put on the cross for you --
We'll, you'd better be right.
(and remember, if you're reading this, you may never say you weren't told)
1 Corinthians 6:9-10 -- Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither the immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor sexual perverts, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor robbers will inherit the kingdom of God.
Leviticus 18:22-23 -- You shall not lie with a male as with a woman; it is an abomination. And you shall not lie with any beast and defile yourself with it; neither shall any woman give herself to a beast to lie with it. It is perversion.
Romans 1:26-27 -- For this reason God gave them up to dishonorable passions. Their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural, and the men likewise gave up natural relations with women and were consumed with passion for one another, men committing shameless acts with men and receiving in their own persons the due penalty for their error.
And, if you say there is no GOD that sent his one and only Son to be put on the cross for you --
We'll, you'd better be right.
(and remember, if you're reading this, you may never say you weren't told)
1 Corinthians 6:9-10 -- Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither the immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor sexual perverts, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor robbers will inherit the kingdom of God.
Leviticus 18:22-23 -- You shall not lie with a male as with a woman; it is an abomination. And you shall not lie with any beast and defile yourself with it; neither shall any woman give herself to a beast to lie with it. It is perversion.
Romans 1:26-27 -- For this reason God gave them up to dishonorable passions. Their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural, and the men likewise gave up natural relations with women and were consumed with passion for one another, men committing shameless acts with men and receiving in their own persons the due penalty for their error.
caseyjones955
Well-Known Member
There is plenty of research that supports the hypothesis that gay folks are wired that way innately. Nature vs. Nurture if you will. When I started meeting gay folks after moving to Seattle I asked questions, I listened to stories of how it effected their family relationships and complicated growing up and I would tend to believe that it is not a choice. Being straight I'm not able to directly empathize but it's some pretty heavy stuff. I hope I interpreted your quoted scripture correctly but I'm getting that they made some sort of error to be punished for? In considering processing information for ones own consumption, I submit the following.
1. What was said, what is it I'm being asked to believe?
2. Who said it, possible motives/credentials?
3. What evidence supports their assertions?
4. How else can any evidence be interpreted/evidence to the contrary?
5. After consideration of all of the above, what is most likely to be the truth?
It's sort of a stripped down version of critical thinking but it's hard to say that it fails to make sense. I respect the Bible as a positive power in the lives of many folks but I also realize it is fiction, when abused it also makes a fine weapon and an excellent crutch, as illustrated in the gay marriage ban. What ever our individual feelings on the Bible are, it is dead wrong inflict it on folks that are not hurting others and have other beliefs. This legislation finally reversed a HUGE injustice born of the same ignorance.
Biker Dash
Well-Known Member
caseyjones955
Well-Known Member
The dragon appears to be consenting, but we should cut the tail off and count the rings to make sure it's of age.
Biker Dash
Well-Known Member
Thats a T-Rex. And you go ahead and get between the two of them... I don't know which one to be more afraid of. The giant, carnivorous beast with razor sharp teeth and perpetual PMS, or the dude ballsy enough to fuck it!
85 MAX-fan
Well-Known Member
Well Dave, are you one of the coolaid drinkers that believes the lie that there is a social security fund? There isnt. The money flowing out comes directly from the general fund.
People that are, oh shall we say commiting social security fraud by lying about a back injury for instance are being paid by those honest working class people that pay into SS. NOT FROM PROPERTY TAXES.
While you may frequent the checkout lines at Walmart to obtain your facts within the pages of the National Enquirer I would suggest that you check the online resources made available from the government accounting offices. There you will find more SS funds going out than comming in. Currently huge numbers are reaping more money than they payed in which means the young people who actually work and pay taxes get fucked by those who, again for example, are lying about a back injury to collect SS disability.
Traumahawk
Well-Known Member
I think that the supreme court did get it right.....read this....
(NaturalNews) The legal argument of gay marriage proponents is that because gay marriage is legal in a majority of states, that "right" cannot be infringed by the remaining states which opposed gay marriage. The U.S. Supreme Court, in granting this new, nationwide right to gay marriage, cited the Fourteenth Amendment of the Constitution, Section 1, which states:
No state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
The actual ruling text of the SCOTUS decision makes it clear that its "equal protection" logic would apply universally to concealed carry gun rights which already exist in a majority of states:
(1) The fundamental liberties protected by the Fourteenth Amendment's Due Process Clause extend to certain personal choices central to individual dignity and autonomy, including intimate choices defining personal identity and beliefs... When new insight reveals discord between the Constitution's central protections and a received legal stricture, a claim to liberty must be addressed. Applying these tenets, the Court has long held the right to marry is protected by the Constitution.
Similarly, the right to keep and bear arms has also long been protected by the Constitution and affirmed in multiple Supreme Court decisions, as early as last year. "In District of Columbia v Heller (2008) -- the SCOTUS ruled that the 2nd Amendment rights were 'fundamental' in and of themselves as well as 'fundamental to the Nation's scheme of ordered liberty'" writes Hawkins at Breitbart.com.
SCOTUS may have nullified gun control laws by legalizing gay marriage
The Supreme Court, in other words, appears to have just nullified gun control laws all across America.
As Bob Owens writes on BearingArms.com, "By using the Constitution in such a manner, the Court argues that the Due Process Clause extends 'certain personal choices central to individual dignity and autonomy' accepted in a majority of states across the state lines of a handful of states that still banned the practice. The vast majority of states are 'shall issue' on the matter of issuing concealed carry permits, and enjoy reciprocity with a large number of other states."
He continues:
I'll be driving through the District of Columbia, Maryland, New Jersey, and New York in several weeks, places that until yesterday I did not have a legal right to concealed carry. As of today, with this decision, it would seem that these states and the District must honor my concealed carry permit, or violate my constitutional rights under the 14th and Second Amendment.
http://www.naturalnews.com/050237_SCOTUS_gun_laws_same-sex_marriage.html
(NaturalNews) The legal argument of gay marriage proponents is that because gay marriage is legal in a majority of states, that "right" cannot be infringed by the remaining states which opposed gay marriage. The U.S. Supreme Court, in granting this new, nationwide right to gay marriage, cited the Fourteenth Amendment of the Constitution, Section 1, which states:
No state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
The actual ruling text of the SCOTUS decision makes it clear that its "equal protection" logic would apply universally to concealed carry gun rights which already exist in a majority of states:
(1) The fundamental liberties protected by the Fourteenth Amendment's Due Process Clause extend to certain personal choices central to individual dignity and autonomy, including intimate choices defining personal identity and beliefs... When new insight reveals discord between the Constitution's central protections and a received legal stricture, a claim to liberty must be addressed. Applying these tenets, the Court has long held the right to marry is protected by the Constitution.
Similarly, the right to keep and bear arms has also long been protected by the Constitution and affirmed in multiple Supreme Court decisions, as early as last year. "In District of Columbia v Heller (2008) -- the SCOTUS ruled that the 2nd Amendment rights were 'fundamental' in and of themselves as well as 'fundamental to the Nation's scheme of ordered liberty'" writes Hawkins at Breitbart.com.
SCOTUS may have nullified gun control laws by legalizing gay marriage
The Supreme Court, in other words, appears to have just nullified gun control laws all across America.
As Bob Owens writes on BearingArms.com, "By using the Constitution in such a manner, the Court argues that the Due Process Clause extends 'certain personal choices central to individual dignity and autonomy' accepted in a majority of states across the state lines of a handful of states that still banned the practice. The vast majority of states are 'shall issue' on the matter of issuing concealed carry permits, and enjoy reciprocity with a large number of other states."
He continues:
I'll be driving through the District of Columbia, Maryland, New Jersey, and New York in several weeks, places that until yesterday I did not have a legal right to concealed carry. As of today, with this decision, it would seem that these states and the District must honor my concealed carry permit, or violate my constitutional rights under the 14th and Second Amendment.
http://www.naturalnews.com/050237_SCOTUS_gun_laws_same-sex_marriage.html
Biker Dash
Well-Known Member
Really... gotta resort to name calling now?
There is a flaw in his logic. Those states are gonna fight tooth & nail to nail him to the wall if he uses that reasoning if he gets stopped and busted for illegal carry. It will be one long, drawn-out battle to fight this all the way to the SCOTUS, And the states in question WILL fight him every step of the way, as well as possibly the judges below SCOTUS level.
Still, it is a battle that WILL be fought, and if it is him that fights it, I pray that he emerges victorious.
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