turn signal

[Chillin Dylan]

I'm curious, can you please post picture or link?

I'm not aware of there being a direct replacement. i. e. 5 pin relay that does sel cancel.

I have no idea about self canceling, but it’s only two pin I think. It has spade style connectors that into <2009 VMAXes according to the website
https://www.customled.com/products/elfr-1-qd-electronic-led-flasher-relay

 

[gb.carson]

I'm curious, can you please post picture or link?

I'm not aware of there being a direct replacement. i. e. 5 pin relay that does sel cancel.

I don't think it does - that function will be lost. I have that unit and this is so, also, you cannot replace the bulb in the idiot lights with an LED one or it wont work.

 

[Tom Determan]

A stupid comment about self canceling.... Insurance companies don't like them and here's why, this happened to my cousin 30 years ago in a brand new car, I don't remember the exact specifics but about like this:

His car was hit by another at an intersection. As it was about to be loaded onto a flatbed hauler, the responding officer asked him if he had his signal on when the accident occurred, he said yes. They both just happened to look at his car at that moment, as the driver reached in and turned off the turn signal, which was still flashing. There was his proof of the signal being on.

We all like them on our bikes though !

 

[huw s]

This is very timely. My 86 vmax trike never self canceled - it has leds at the back, 21 W or whatever lamps at the front.
Last weekend I replaced the worn out, noisy messed around with speedometer with a virago one. The original one had a fuse where the reed relay should have been!
So, I, thought self cancelling will now work - no..., Ihad a feeling there was something modified under the scoop. Had another look and the brown, and brown and white to the flasher/safety relay had been cut and an electronic two wire relay fitted. That answered it. Replacing the feed to the flasher relay made the blink fast. Ah, the leds, I thought.
So I tried a 10w bulb - that slowed it down. I ordered a pair of resistors from Amazon.
Lastly, to try the self cancelling - I found it takes a tenth of a mile to cancel - is this about right?
Fingers crossed, by the weekend I will have self cancelling indicators yay...

 

[one2dmax]

I want to say it's around 400'?

 

[huw s]

400 feet Hmmm. I can't see why the virago clock would pulse differently, sure a tenth of a mile is too long, but better than nothing. We'll see what happens when I fit the resistors, but I don't expect it to change.
Huw
Just checked, 400'feet = .07 of a (British) mile. All the same I think? So I'm going 30%further before resetting. It feels too long, but there we are, I don't see a way around it without getting the soldering iron out and making some sort of frequency doubler. And no, won't be doing that.

 

[02GF74]

The signal will cancel after either 10 seconds, or 150 meters (490 feet), whichever is greater.

30 % further brings you to 520 ft ; that is 6 % within the above.

So pretty much spot on - assuming you have standard size tyre fitted inflated to the recommended air pressure and depending on the accuracy of your distance measurement. There is no need for any frequency doublers. (actually 150 m is 492 to you are within 5.6%)

PS the Vmax speedo generates 4 pulses per revolution.

PS 2 If you want to go further or less, then you would need one of these - I would need to reprogram the device.


PS 3 Work is in progress on mk2 version that will deal with LED bulbs.

 

[huw s]

The signal will cancel after either 10 seconds, or 150 meters (490 feet), whichever is greater.

30 % further brings you to 520 ft ; that is 6 % within the above.

So pretty much spot on - assuming you have standard size tyre fitted inflated to the recommended air pressure and depending on the accuracy of your distance measurement. There is no need for any frequency doublers. (actually 150 m is 492 to you are within 5.6%)

PS the Vmax speedo generates 4 pulses per revolution.

PS 2 If you want to go further or less, then you would need one of these - I would need to reprogram the device.
View attachment 76460

PS 3 Work is in progress on mk2 version that will deal with LED bulbs.

Thanks for this, very informative. So my tenth of a mile isn't far out. It doesn't cancel on time, or at least not while the leds are in there.

 

[Chillin Dylan]

So I got the two wire led relay that I linked... where do I plug it in at exactly? Under the left scoop is a 5 wire relay, but I understand this two wire is supposed to be like a piggy back deal, right?

 

[02GF74]

I'm pretty sure you need to remove the original 5 pin relay.

Once I'm on the computer, I'll get the pin out and post on how I would connect it.

BTW this has been done before so a search should give the info.

 

[Chillin Dylan]

I'm pretty sure you need to remove the original 5 pin relay.

Once I'm on the computer, I'll get the pin out and post on how I would connect it.

BTW this has been done before so a search should give the info.

I have trouble with the search function on this forum. If I search turn signal or turn signal relay or anything like that, this thread comes up. And it’s a separate listing for basically every response in this thread

 

[02GF74]

Information gleaned from the internet shows that the wiring for 2 pin flasher is:
B = Battery
L = Load (or Lamps)
or
49 = Battery
49a = Load

B is connection to ignition switch live and L goes to the handlebar 3 position indicator switch that connects left or right bulbs or none of them.

There are 2 types of electronic relays that flash at constant rate (original 2 pin use a bimetallic strip whose flash rate is determined by the load i.e. combined resistance of the bulbs): 2 and 3 pin.

The 3 pin have an additional ground (0V) pin to power the electronic components; whereas the 2 pin charge a capacitor to power the circuit when the 'ground' is disconnected.

B = Battery
L = Load (or Lamps)
E = Ground 0V
or
49 = Battery
49a = Load
31 = Ground or 0V

The 2 wires in the Vmax 5 pin plug to connect to a flasher relay are:
Brown = ignition switch 12 V (B or 49)
Brown/White = Load (L or 49a) goes to handlebar switch to select lamps

And for a 3 pin, the 3rd wire from the connector is:
Black = Ground 0V (E or 31)


Using an aftermarket relay will lose the self-cancellation feature.

 

[Chillin Dylan]

Information gleaned from the internet shows that the wiring for 2 pin flasher is:
B = Battery
L = Load (or Lamps)
or
49 = Battery
49a = Load

B is connection to ignition switch live and L goes to the handlebar 3 position indicator switch that connects left or right bulbs or none of them.

There are 2 types of electronic relays that flash at constant rate (original 2 pin use a bimetallic strip whose flash rate is determined by the load i.e. combined resistance of the bulbs): 2 and 3 pin.

The 3 pin have an additional ground (0V) pin to power the electronic components; whereas the 2 pin charge a capacitor to power the circuit when the 'ground' is disconnected.

B = Battery
L = Load (or Lamps)
E = Ground 0V
or
49 = Battery
49a = Load
31 = Ground or 0V

The 2 wires in the Vmax 5 pin plug to connect to a flasher relay are:
Brown = ignition switch 12 V (B or 49)
Brown/White = Load (L or 49a) goes to handlebar switch to select lamps

And for a 3 pin, the 3rd wire from the connector is:
Black = Ground 0V (E or 31)


Using an aftermarket relay will lose the self-cancellation feature.

I unplugged the factory 5 pin and plugged in then 2 pin like you described. It’s still flashing all 4 turn signals no matter which way the indicator switch is pushed. They do flash much slower now though, so the flash rate is good.

 

[02GF74]

OK, one step forwards.

As I posted earlier, the turn bulb on the instrument panel connects both pairs of indicators together.

If you remove that bulb, normal indicator function should be restored.

If you want the turn bulb to flash, it needs a wiring change so that one end connects to ground (0v) and other via 2 diodes to the indicator power wires.

If you require, I can supply a wiring diagram but not until I get back on the computer.

This mod will allow a LED flash bulb to be fitted.

The way the flash bulb is wired, it stops flashing if both bulbs are blown on one side, this feature is lost but I don't think that is a big deal.

 

[Chillin Dylan]

Ahh okay now I understand. I thought that by using an aftermarket relay, I could keep the dash bulb. That’s my bad. I would definitely like to make the dash bulb flash again at a later date, but for now it’ll be okay. Just itching to ride again!

 

[huw s]

Hi, mine had an aftermarket flasher (not a simple bimetalic). (Oh, this is on a gen1 1985). Anyway, on mine the brown (feed) wire to the original flasher and the white on brown had been cut, the flasher connected to the loom end of these, and it worked with leds. Worked well, just didn't self cancel.
I have since reconnected the brown, white on brown to the original flasher, fitted the resitors across the rear leds and now I have self cancelling again, but they don't cancel on time, just distance.

 

[Ryce]

Placing my question in this thread is better placed. The GPS speedometer didn't have an output for the flasher relay. So I was thinking that the Arduino Nano could produce a pulse stream that mimicked the reed switch open/closing function. Just keep it (the Nano) on/off continuously. As that would happen anyway. Except when not moving. Does anyone see a problem with that? I just want the thing to turn off after 10 seconds or so. There is a GPS shield (a circuit board) that can be added to an Ardunio) so maybe that can provide a movement based pulse stream. I am new to the Ardunio and also a old guy so I don't learn as quickly. Any feedback would be appreciated. My bike is a 2000 gen I that I bought used a few months back and still learning the bike. It has many bells and whistles that has modified the wiring a little bit.

Thanks

Ryce

 

[02GF74]

pretty sure I've posted about this but you're on the right track in that you need to simulate the closing of the reed switch in the speedo, and yes, it can run continuously so indicator cancels after a given time but loses the cancel after a distance feature.

A NE555 timer running at 82 Hz, a transistor to switch a relay is all you need. Max supply voltage for NE555 is 16 V (add a diode to drop that a bit) and it is far more robust and simple than ardionoino.

 

[huw s]

pretty sure I've posted about this but you're on the right track in that you need to simulate the closing of the reed switch in the speedo, and yes, it can run continuously so indicator cancels after a given time but loses the cancel after a distance feature.

A NE555 timer running at 82 Hz, a transistor to switch a relay is all you need. Max supply voltage for NE555 is 16 V (add a diode to drop that a bit) and it is far more robust and simple than ardionoino.

Yes to this, don't bother with the arduino - unless it's doing something else more useful?
Some years ago I did a degree project (BEng hons) that was using a Microchip pic to run efi and ignition. I spent ages trying to produce a square wave that varied in frequency according to a pot setting. Days and days. In the end I used a 555 and it was working in an hour....
The efi worked too, but was rather crude.

 

[Okie2ee]

Royce, here's what the 555 circuit looks like in case you haven't found it yet..................



This is the astable circuit whichs oscillates when power is applied to the circuit............an output device like a transistor or small relay would be connected between pins 3 and 1.