bolt on chain conversion kit

[xschop]

"""""once you cut into that cavity there isn't a seal between the transmission and the cavity"""""

On the Max, does the tranny oil bathe the middle drive oil then?

 

[TURBOVMAX]

I ran into the dilemma of putting the chainpath of the XS11 outside the stock left frame pivot originally and found that with ANY single sided swingarm you could make a rear sprocket spacer to line up with the chain very easily (nothing in the way to go as far out as you'd like). But I don't like that look....too "Harly-esque".
The second method for the max (just by looking at pics) looks like the stock shaft does not have to be modded or welded on......this is the ideal method.....have you ever tried to lathe a hardened shaft?:bang head::bang head::bang head:

Hard turning is common now a days. We even turn to ground shaft tolerances. Ceramic inserts for the lathe bit. Normally the shafts are only about a RC 50-55 which you can turn using carbide inserts. When they use the shaft as an actual bearing surface... as in roller bearing then they jack the Rockwell up to 60+ then it's harder to turn.

 

[xschop]

I trim the XS11 shaft using a grinding attachment on the lathe because I have to turn down the catch splines.....
Does anyone have a pic of the stock Vmax output shaft?
A custom offset sprocket could be done and incorporate a bearing surface like you say...just another idea.

 

[veebooster]

That's an awesome looking XS!!!!:eusa_dance:

Wish I could help you guys but you're wayyy over my head.


Dale #2592

 

[one2dmax]

To use the second method you have to cut off the shaft right after the splines. I will try to remember to get you a picture if I can get over to my spare parts tonight.

If you want I can send you about anything you would like to measure up to and including a complete set of engine cases (empty to simplify things) and or transmissions (I have a couple of those modifed transmissions too). I even have a frame or two laying around if you wanted to mock it all up.

Sean

 

[xschop]

After taking another look at the Vmax, maybe running the chain outside the frame wouldn't be bad looking at all, because the output cover is already out there and the max is a Haus anyways.....
Here's the swingarm I used for the 11......I would go with a Ducati also.........
See how easy it would be to put on a rear sprocket spacer between drive hub and rear sprocket for the chain if ran outside frame.....Not to mention rear tire size could go BIG 240 plus I'm sure.
With the XS11 I had to notch the inner frame tube and braceweld, although easy enough.
http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread.php?t=11649&highlight=triumph+swingarm&page=7

 

[robsplatf4]

xs, If you ever need an extra hand on this job lemme know. I can help a little bit. I'd also be very interested in buying your final kit.

 

[xschop]

Hey Sean, I see what you're talking about (shaft cut off after splines)....
I believe I see another way of going about placing a sprocket on the shaft without cutting it, but that requires still machining the chain path....
I also see a way to have a true bolt-on solution, but the chain-path runs right next to the outside of the frame pivot (SSSA would be easy to do/way to go)

Is the circled area a custom bearing or a seal?

 

[xschop]

Hey Rob, where you located? I would be glad to help with a swingarm mock-up.

 

[TURBOVMAX]

Hey Sean, I see what you're talking about (shaft cut off after splines)....
I believe I see another way of going about placing a sprocket on the shaft without cutting it, but that requires still machining the chain path....
I also see a way to have a true bolt-on solution, but the chain-path runs right next to the outside of the frame pivot (SSSA would be easy to do/way to go)

Is the circled area a custom bearing or a seal?

Just a seal

 

[xschop]

O.K. thanks.
Does anyone know the spline dimensions on the shaft (where the outter bevel pinion rides on)?

 

[TURBOVMAX]

O.K. thanks.
Does anyone know the spline dimensions on the shaft (where the outter bevel pinion rides on)?

Measured with a vernier caliper...

28 Teeth
Major Dia. 1.137
Minor Dia 1.060

And here's a pic of the output shaft for reference.

 

[xschop]

Ok, now the middle drive schematic shows the outter bevel gear rides on those splines, kept in place by the large oil-type roller bearing on the outter case? (Bevel gear shaft O.D. rides inside the I.D. of that roller bearing)

If this is true, I have a solution....

 

[one2dmax]

More pics

 

[xschop]

What part of the set-up rides on the splines? the Bevel gear RightThe schematic has it going thru the outter roller bearing locked in place by the nut. I could also make out that the roller bearing is locked into the case by a clip.

 

[TURBOVMAX]

What part of the set-up rides on the splines? the Bevel gear RightThe schematic has it going thru the outter roller bearing locked in place by the nut. I could also make out that the roller bearing is locked into the case by a clip.

Correct, with the cut case version the sprocket is then welded to a piece of the original bevel gear spline and a spacer replaces the spring. As you know I'm sure... it's time for you to get some parts in your hands. As Sean has suggested a frame, old set of cases w/transmission and a fuel tank which is also going to get in your way.

With the cut case version the fuel tank has to be modified for the chain path. That mod is basically a right angle cut on the lower left side. The version that places the sprocket on the outside of the frame rails is pretty straight forward, but as you can see with the drag bike pics I've posted... it really can't look clean. Believe me in 25 years there's been some pretty clever people that have taken a shot at doing a true bolt on. Bottom line... it's expensive to do a chain drive conversion.

A major problem with the VMAX is the frame. It's weak... it's been braced, and gusseted to death. It's also amazed me that more people haven't offered a redeigned version incorporating a bolt on chain drive conversion. Always easier to start off with a blank sheet of paper. When I look back on all of the mods I've made to it. I think... why didn't you just make a new one. Kill two birds with one stone, but again it won't be cheap.

This winter I'll make a frame based around sport bike/cruiser geometry. My offer stands... if someone wants to work on making the outboard chain drive cartridge, I'll work with it.

 

[robsplatf4]

Hey Rob, where you located? I would be glad to help with a swingarm mock-up.

Southside near 240 and penn, I also work downtown.

 

[one2dmax]

The chaindrive conversion we have with the sprocket coming out of the un-modified case is about your best bet. It keeps the bearings lubricated, doesn't cut your case, and doesn't reduce the tank size. However, it will have to have an offset sprocket to clear the frame (or frame welding would need done). Then it will have to use something different (maybe) for the shift linkage (which the Venture linkage would maybe be a benefit).

Sean

 

[xschop]

I double checked the shift linkage and that's a no brainer with spacer plates.
I had already made up my mind that I would design a true bolt-on kit that you would not have to cut your case OR REMOVE YOUR ENGINE. I am goint to take it one step further and design it with a replaceable sprocket just like I did on the XS bikes. I ahve access to a complete Venture Engine and my friend (18 yr certified Yamaha mechanic) says it has the exact innerds as the Vmax. I do want to be 100% sure that all the middle drive components are all the same through-out the Year models because I will be machining custom drive extentions that replace the bevel gear.....
I may take you up on the offer of the parts loan to save completely tearing apart the Venture motor. I will dismantle the middle drive housing and do some prelims.....

 

[one2dmax]

How do you propose to remove the beveled gear from the cases? If you note the size of the gear it's larger then the outer support bearing. The rear beveled gear is simple with 3 bolts and a quick pull. Then make a plate to cover up the hole. Even if you remove the outer bearing (which can probably be done) the hole to get the inner gear simply isn't large enough to get it out.

Sean