Steering Head Bearing

[Saml01]

Have you tried just letting go of the steering and seeing what happens?

 

[Redbone]

Have you tried just letting go of the steering and seeing what happens?

Yep, at different speeds it is the same, nothing happens!
FYI: Stock height shocks @ 13", and lowered forks by 2" to add to the list of mods done to my bike.

 

[Saml01]

I followed your advice. I released the lower triple to try reduce any built up tension and it actually did something. Before the bike used to wobble bad from 40-55, now it wobbles around 35 - 45 and is rock solid all the way up to 110.

Weird...shit.

 

[ncdoc0623414]

I tried to cut/grind out the bottom outer race as you suggested, but it just wouldn't work for me and I started marring up the neck. I eventually found a novel approach on another thread. For the bottom outer race, I simply dremel'd out a "dannymax" notch and it became SO simple to punch out--check out my "Steering Bearing Maintenance" album (http://www.vmaxforum.net/album.php?albumid=553) and dannymax's original post (http://www.vmaxforum.net/showpost.php?p=157563&postcount=9). I didn't need to this for the upper outer race 'cause there was just enough of a race lip sticking out that I could punch it out OK. For the bottom bearing, I cut the cage apart and loosed the rollers. After that I kind of followed your lead and dremel'd a slot into the inner race, drove a chisel into the slot enough times to split the race off of the stem and then just punched the race down the stem.

i read this in hopes to diagnose my decel wobble and have a bit of advice from working with bearings every day as a maint tech at a flooring plant. they have a puller that will go inside and lock onto race with tabs. and it has a slide hammer to pull it.

when that doesnt work and penetrating oil doesnt help i move on to more drastic measures

the welder ..... if u just put a quick spot weld on the inside of the race it will draw itself in and become smaller in size. do not weld it to anything just put a bead on the race.. should pop right out.

also take great care upon installation of new bearings most bearings that fail are from poor installation methods. i have a set that has progressive sizes of brass pipe select the one that is the size of the outer race and use it to install the new bearing. keeping it square and not damaging seals, cup or inner race.

 

[ludog29]

I was having problems installing the lower bearing and decided to stop by ACE Hardware to see if I could come up with a way to get the job done cheaply.
I don't know if I got the Cheap part done but I was able to make a tool that would put the bearing down evenly and with out binding or damage.

I used
steel tube 1.25 x 12
threaded to hose adapter 1.25
and cap 1 1/4.

I had to dremel out the inside of the adapter to get any ruff edges out and after that it fit nicely.

 

[[email protected]]

Nice work. I dig home made tools. I've got quite a collection. I like to take the old bearing race and cut a slit all the way thru and use it to drive the new race in. Works for the cups in the head and swingarm too.

 

[sdt354]

The welder is the least painful way to remove the bottom race, if you have access to one. But, the notch cut for a punch works well too. My first time, I ground almost through the race then split it with a chisel and it dropped out. I'll be greasing and inspecting my bearings as a yearly maintenance thing now. Kyle's idea of a grease fitting is one I might try too. I wouldn't delay if there is any possible doubt about bearing condition. You'll be surprised after taking everything apart how worn things were.
A tank slapper at over 100 mph is incredible to experience, usually after hitting a bump in the road. The bars will be shaking like crazy. Don't hit the brakes hard if you're into a wobble. Get down on the lid putting your weight forward and ease off the throttle. You'll get religion in the process. The longest few seconds of your life.
Steve-o

 

[Tim spain]

I am fixing to put a grease fitting in the neck of mine so I can shoot some new grease in there from time to time. Harley was even smart enough to put a grease fitting in a lot of there bikes.

Great idea, most of my old Triumphs had this, all you needed to do was fill up the grease gun and pump in the grease until it visibly comes out the top and bottom bearings. I was thinking about doing this to my 1st gen when I need to rebuild the steering head area/bearings etc. The swingarms on my old Triumphs had a grease fitting too, made life so much easier.

 

[Tim spain]

When I bought my bike I thought everything was fine until riding another vmax. In the process I discovered that my steering was very tight. I didnt read the FSM, so I tightened the ring nuts and the bike was not ride-able. Then I loosened the ring nuts and gave the bike to my friend, he pointed out that it shimmies at 40 - 55mph. I followed the FSM to the letter this time and the bike rides better than ever. However the shimmy is still there, take your hands off the handlebars and the shimmy turns into a tank slapper.

The bike has 13k miles on it, and I am not sure if I should go looser on the ring nuts. Experience says I should but im not sure.

Thoughts?

When I rode my 1st gen home after buying it I was horrified to find that unless both hands were firmly on the bars, a massive wobble set in. Initially I was very unhappy and thought that I'd bought a lemon, but after careful thought, I stripped down the head bearing area, and relubed everything after checking the bearing races were ok. The yamaha service tool as quoted in the service manual does appear to give a misleading indication of the actual torque applied to the ring nuts, due to the mechanical advantage etc of the tool itself. I tightened the ring to the 36 or so ft/lbs and then backed it off by feel. I can't be more specific than that I'm afraid, but I've been working on bikes/cars since I was 14 years old. Anyhow, the upshot was that all of the wobble etc etc had gone away completely. I can take both hands of the bars at 60mph or so with no issues whatsoever, rock steady. Also no tightness in the steering etc.

 

[Fire-medic]

Sean Morley's steering head adjustment video:

Fork service:

 

[WC Hart]

Gentlemen, I am in the process of mountiing a 94 front end on my 86 Max. I have looked at this entire thread and have not seen anyone talk about removing the retaining pin on the bottom triple in order to replace the bottom bearing. can any one address this please

 

[Fire-medic]

Here's the factory service manual: VMX12- Service-Manual.pdf (vmoa.net)

See chapter 6/front fork. The steering head section begins at p.35. The steering stem stays on the lower triple tree. If you want to replace the lower bearing, most people cut it off with an abrasive wheel and then a cold chisel.

 

[WC Hart]

thanks for the info. i looked at the service manual before and it does not address the pin on the back of the lower triple. i thought it was an allen screw at first but after looking closer its a pin. i don't know how to get this pin out.

 

[Parminio]

Gentlemen, I am in the process of mountiing a 94 front end on my 86 Max. I have looked at this entire thread and have not seen anyone talk about removing the retaining pin on the bottom triple in order to replace the bottom bearing. can any one address this please

You're losing me.

Bottom bearing on the triple? Forgive my ignorance, but I didn't think there was one. I know there's a cover down there to keep dirt out but I thought that was it.

Are you talking about this part:

 

[Fire-medic]

thanks for the info. i looked at the service manual before and it does not address the pin on the back of the lower triple. i thought it was an allen screw at first but after looking closer its a pin. i don't know how to get this pin out.

Unless you have a press, most people cut the bearing off.

#1: lower bearing; #3: upper bearing

Both are tapered. Don't forget to remove/replace the outer races in the frame neck. If you plan to hold onto your bike, after removing the outer race, it's a good time to grind reliefs 180 degrees apart in the steering head lip for the outer bearing race. It makes it much easier to remove the next time. Guys with a welder run a short bead or two, the heat and the weld bead make it easy to just drop it out using a punch or a chisel. That was mentioned previously in another post here.



If you didn't have a lower bearing, you'd have at-least have to have a bushing, but the extra clearance you'd need for it would make for interesting handling. Think of the steering head like the ball joints for the A-arms of an independent front suspension on a car/truck, but instead of bushings/ball joints, you have upper and lower tapered roller bearings. Fork stop to fork stop, you probably have something like fifty degrees of lateral movement.

The wear of a steering head bearing results in brinelling which you can see and feel. The outer bearing surface is no longer smooth, it develops indentations. You can run your finger along the outer bearing race, and feel them. Looking at the outer bearing race with a strong light, you can see alternating light and dark areas. Bearings wear prematurely from:

lack of adequate lubrication
dirt/debris
too-tight
too-loose

 

[Parminio]

I still don't think that's what he's talking about. How could he think a roll pin holds that in place?

 

[WC Hart]

I'm talking about the bearing on the stem on top of the bottom tree. it will only come off and reinstall with the lower tree off of the stem. On the back of the tree there is a pin that I assume keeps the tree and stem secure. So to remove the lower bearing on stem and install a new one, how do I remove the bottom tree.

 

[WC Hart]

here is the pin i'm talking about

 

[WC Hart]

Parminio, I might very well be being thick about this pin, thats why i put the question out to all you Vmax rocket scientist. Please tell me I'm reading this wrong. If this pin does not having anything to do with the removal of the lower tree tell me what it's for

 

[TK3333]

Leave the pin in. Carefully cut the race with a dremmel. You dont have to go all the way thru, you can break it with a punch once scored enough. I cut a piece out of mine and used it along with conduit as a driver for the new one. There was a thread covering this pretty well.