Bike STILL wobbles at speed

[naughtyG]

The single biggest difference in stability is if I put my feet out on the crash bar pegs. Do that, stable all day long. Tucked in on the normal pegs, it usually gets squirrely around 110-120. When I got a new rear tire that seemed to help a bit also.

I think the rear is where it really mostly comes from. Sure having head bearings in good condition and well adjusted also helps, but the rear man, that I think is mostly it - namely that big fat 150/90 tire (170/80 makes only a tiny difference).

Funnily, I noticed that when riding two-up it never wobbled.. I think the best way to totally eradicate it is to go 17" or 18" on the rear wheel, and lower profile tire. Shame it's so damn expensive to do so!

 

[VmaxRider85]

i run stock tire sizes but i use metezler marathons on the 85 though they dont have the RWL they handle good and no wobble..

 

[Lew L]

Did the Furbur Fix and adjusted the steering head bearings and no more wobbles. Raised the forkes in the tripple trees about 3/4" and running a 120 front tire. Solid at all speeds.

Lew

 

[VmaxRider85]

furbur fix?? what is that ?? and got any pics with the 120 tires might be getting one if i like

 

[FootNote]

I am planning on getting my tires ball ended because I have this same problem. I really hope it's not a serius issue.

 

[naughtyG]

furbur fix?? what is that ??

It's simply replacing the rubber washer between the two castle nuts that hold the steering bearings in place with a solid washer instead. Most people reckon it's simply a band-aid to mask the real problem - ***'d steering bearings.

This is actually a pretty good read when it comes to steering bearings, I find myself agreeing with most of it: http://vmax.lvlhead.com/tips/vmaxshakes.htm

The gist of it is: make sure your head bearings are in good shape and properly adjusted.

 

[Sonoran6]

if you cant get it to stop wobbling with all the different possibilities examined and corrected if needed you could get a steering damper, those help with wobble right?

 

[Barry barker]

If the head bearings are too loose or worn a steering damper will not help. My head bearings were dry from the factory. Luckly I discovered this with about 2500 miles on the bike while performing the fubur fix. i greased up the head bearings tighten them per the bounce test, using of all things, a pair of channel locks. No wobbles! i regrease the bearings about every 10000 to 15000 miles, i have almost 44000 miles on my bike and have service the head bearings 3 or 4 times. Stock bearing still look great.

RA come down to Arkansas and ride my bike, i am confident it will change your mind about high speed on a Vmax. You are welcome to stay in our guest room. I only see two issues:

Have yet to find a road where you can get past 120 before slowing down, to many hills, and curves.:eusa_dance:
You would change your opinion about Avon Tyres:clapping:

 

[RaWarrior]

I can't see how the furbur fix can possibly do anything. You're swapping a washer between two nuts. I think any improvements from it are more likely from "accidentally" tightening the nuts in the process of removing and reinstalling the washer.

I haven't ridden any sportbikes with Avon tires, but my buddy has a Harley with them. It handles like garbage, and in that case I'm not sure it's entirely the bike's fault. It has the exact same problem my Max did, the ass end tends to "walk out" in corners. It's like riding knobby tires on pavement....won't hold a line. I dunno if the radials are any better, but their Venom bias tire is a piece of soap.

I've also heard a lot of arguments that suggest the Max's reputation for dodgy handling can also be blamed on poor alignment from the factory, which makes sense why it still isn't perfectly stable. But it's a lot better than it was, and honestly I've just let it go as "good enough".

 

[Sonoran6]

If the head bearings are too loose or worn a steering damper will not help.

Exactly, which is why I mentioned the damper as a correction after other issues were addressed and corrected.

 

[Barry barker]

QUOTE=RaWarrior;248055]I can't see how the furbur fix can possibly do anything. You're swapping a washer between two nuts. I think any improvements from it are more likely from "accidentally" tightening the nuts in the process of removing and reinstalling the washer.

I haven't ridden any sportbikes with Avon tires, but my buddy has a Harley with them. It handles like garbage, and in that case I'm not sure it's entirely the bike's fault. It has the exact same problem my Max did, the ass end tends to "walk out" in corners. It's like riding knobby tires on pavement....won't hold a line. I dunno if the radials are any better, but their Venom bias tire is a piece of soap.

I've also heard a lot of arguments that suggest the Max's reputation for dodgy handling can also be blamed on poor alignment from the factory, which makes sense why it still isn't perfectly stable. But it's a lot better than it was, and honestly I've just let it go as "good enough".

The furber fix is swaping an aluminum washer for a stock rubber one. The rubber one will take very limited torque before deforming. This deformation causes play in the head bearing.

No problem, I will keep the Avon tyres to myself.

Take one more stab at the head bearings, as previously stated, I will bet they loosened up and could use a slight tightening. The head bearings are very sensitive to torque. We need to get your bike better than good enough!!

 

[Barry barker]

Exactly, which is why I mentioned the damper as a correction after other issues were addressed and corrected.

if you cant get it to stop wobbling with all the different possibilities examined and corrected if needed you could get a steering damper, those help with wobble right?

Sorry, I guess I misunderstood

 

[Sonoran6]

Sorry, I guess I misunderstood

all good unk:

 

[Barry barker]

I haven't ridden any sportbikes with Avon tires, but my buddy has a Harley with them. It handles like garbage, and in that case I'm not sure it's entirely the bike's fault. It has the exact same problem my Max did, the ass end tends to "walk out" in corners. It's like riding knobby tires on pavement....won't hold a line. I dunno if the radials are any better, but their Venom bias tire is a piece of soap.

The symptoms you are describing are usually caused by softly dampened suspension and /or frame flexing. Stock Harleys have these issues in spades! The new models should be better since they redesigned the frames. The Vmax is essentially a 1985 motorcycle design with a weak frame for sporty handling. It needs a few updates to run with modern bikes.

 

[naughtyG]

The furber fix is swapping an aluminum washer for a stock rubber one. The rubber one will take very limited torque before deforming. This deformation causes play in the head bearing.

Not really sure I agree with this, as the rubber washer isn't meant to get any torque at all- it just stops the bottom castle nut from turning, which is the one that must be torqued exactly right.

So, you torque the bottom nut so that there's no play in the bearings, and then either put the rubber washer next and the top nut finger tight above and aligned to the bottom (factory) or the top nut first (holding the bottom tight and using the top as a lock nut) then the washer as a spacer between the castle nuts and the triple tree (lvlhead's way). Then the triple tree top nut gets a high torque to keep everything in place.

Makes sense?

 

[speedcostsmoney]

tire pressure 38 psi front tire 44 psi rear tire should help u , if u got stock vmax rims go for some AVON VENOMS they come in vmax sizes, and are way better than metzeler on dry and especial on wet roads they are usaully a little less expensive than other tires

 

[RaWarrior]

That may be true about flame flex or squishy rear suspension, but when I swapped the Avon for the Metz, the problem suddey vanished. Same frame, same suspension. So it's pretty obviously the tires.

The HD was a '10 or '11 Street Bob. It was a phenomenal POS. I started calling it the Weeble, it liked to wiggle and wobble at every speed. A steady 55mph cruise seemed to be it's only comfort zone.

 

[ouchez]

That may be true about flame flex or squishy rear suspension, but when I swapped the Avon for the Metz, the problem suddey vanished. Same frame, same suspension. So it's pretty obviously the tires.

The HD was a '10 or '11 Street Bob. It was a phenomenal POS. I started calling it the Weeble, it liked to wiggle and wobble at every speed. A steady 55mph cruise seemed to be it's only comfort zone.

I run front and rear Avon Venoms, like them just fine.

O

 

[Barry barker]

Not really sure I agree with this, as the rubber washer isn't meant to get any torque at all- it just stops the bottom castle nut from turning, which is the one that must be torqued exactly right.

So, you torque the bottom nut so that there's no play in the bearings, and then either put the rubber washer next and the top nut finger tight above and aligned to the bottom (factory) or the top nut first (holding the bottom tight and using the top as a lock nut) then the washer as a spacer between the castle nuts and the triple tree (lvlhead's way). Then the triple tree top nut gets a high torque to keep everything in place.

Makes sense?

Good point and I agree, but the rubber washer dosn't work as designed. The bottom nut loosens up during riding because the rubber washer deforms under this torque, now you have loose head bearings. My experience with the rubber washer has always been one of continuing maintenance. The aluminum or steel washer is a set it and forget it. In fact, i do not even have a washer anymore. 2 castle nuts, a lock spline, and a triple tree nut.

 

[Barry barker]

Not sure how you set up the rear shocks, try setting the dampening on 3 or full and give the springs 2 clicks of preload. Air the tires to at least OEM and maybe 2#s over. i would raise the triple trees back up to the top of the forks. If possible, this would be a good time to check the head bearings again. If a little loose, tighten just barely.

As you pass triple digits, keep a lite grip on the bars and tuck your body behind the faux tank. Your body is a big sail and at that speed can envoke numerous forces on the bike that i can not explain but will cause it to weave. i know you have done some of these things, just not sure if you have tried all of them together.