Flywheel puller failed; bolt stuck........

[gamorg02]

Hmm, the bolts I got with my autozone kit had the markings(and color) of grade 8 bolts.

was this it?
http://www.autozone.com/autozone/ac...&fromString=search&itemIdentifier=555524_0_0_

A trick we did at the marina once for a particularly stubborn flywheel was attatch the jaw style puller, put as much tension on it's bolt as we felt comfortable with (so as to not strip it), then made a little yoke of chain and put in around the center bolt. We have a big-ass slide hammer, put that on the other length of chain and went nuts with it. After each hit you'll probably have to re-tighten the puller's bolt. After a few good slams with the slide it popped off.

We also did the same thing with the jaw puller, except we used the winch of the marina's quad to pull on the jaw. Just as it started dragging the quad on pavement, it broke loose also.

none of that stuff would work i don't think. a quick search showed most of the attachments for slide hammers have a 4/5 in max spread I need like about 6.

i'm thinking to go grab the OTC one so I have it. the local machine shop said to call the bike shop, they said to call the machine shop. i'll try again in a bit

 

[satariel666]

yea the local machine shop i'm sure could re-tap the hole or make new ones. also calling them about getting it off i should have an answer in a bit.

$300 isn't the end of the world, but i'd like to not try to ruin it.

what are the inside of the flywheels, are they hardened steel? ie would drilling and taping 3 new holes be almost impossible with common drill even if i could get some carbide bits?

I have always been using the oustide jaw puller, never bothered any stock shaped puller. Flywheels are made from mild steel, not too mild but soft enough to machine.

 

[satariel666]

This flywheeel is lightweighted for good LOL

 

[gamorg02]

I have always been using the oustide jaw puller, never bothered any stock shaped puller. Flywheel are made from mild steel, not too mild but soft enough to machine.

whats your trick with the outside jaw puller? do you use an impact gun? I have an electric 1/2" drive that can put a lot of pressure on.

thinking of picking up this puller in a bit:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/e...10157048874&ssPageName=ADME:X:RTQ:MOTORS:1123

 

[satariel666]

Non tricks Garret.

I just have a big one, aprox. 20lbs of weight.
No impact gun, torque tight with hands and slight smash onto screw with 10lbs hammer.

 

[gamorg02]

Non tricks Garret.

I just have a big one, aprox. 20lbs of weight.
No impact gun, torque tight with hands and slight smash onto screw with 10lbs hammer.

this one looks pretty heavy duty so i'll give it a go.

how do you keep the flywheel from spinning when u torque it down? I assume you do it by hand but still probably put 100Nm or so on it?

 

[satariel666]

this one looks pretty heavy duty so i'll give it a go.

how do you keep the flywheel from spinning when u torque it down? I assume you do it by hand but still probably put 100Nm or so on it?

Engage the 5th gear first. You may also ask someone to hold your rear brake pressed.

Put a piece of pipe beteween the jaws to make some leverage, should work.

Good luck!


Edit:
One thingy you must look after, watch out to not damage the protrusions with the jaws.
I now a one guy here whose flywheel have a hudge scratch on the one protrusion.
No, pickups dont work on that one anymore...

 

[gamorg02]

Engage the 5th gear first. You may also ask someone to hold your rear brake pressed.

Put a piece of pipe beteween the jaws to make some leverage, should work.

Good luck!

i don't have a clutch installed..

i could use the impact gun and just go until it gets snug

 

[satariel666]

Do you have any metric 32 eyed wrench on hand?
You can hold the flywhell by this way.

 

[gamorg02]

Do you have any metric 32 eyed wrench on hand?
You can hold the flywhell by this way.

i think you mean open end, or closed end wrench right?

no i don't, nor would i be able to find one around here. I have 32 mm sockets or a cresent wrench that fits. should I jam a cresent wrench on the engine guard maybe?

 

[satariel666]

Eyed as we calling it here - again i was not able to find a direct translation...

As we calling:

Eyed on the right, flat on the left.


Jamming tools overall is a good idea, you may also try this way.

 

[gamorg02]

Eyed as we calling it here - again i was not able to find a direct translation...

As we calling:

Eyed on the right, flat on the left.


Jamming tools overall is a good idea, you may also try this way.

i follow.
i call the right -> box end
and the left -> open end

 

[satariel666]

Cool thanks.

You are the best dictionary as it goes with these words LOL

 

[gamorg02]

no problem my friend.

 

[Miles Long]

Hi Garret-
Sorry to see that the flywheel removal is causing you so much grief.
I have not had to remove the flywheel on my bike as yet, so I have only read the section on removal in the Clymer manual.
To hold the flywheel while tightening the puller centre bolt, Yamaha has a special tool called a "sheave Holder" I think a strap wrench, maybe better still a chain wrench with a piece of protective rubber wrapped around the flywheel circumfrence, would do just as well as the Yam. tool.
If you do find a puller with external arms, this will give you free access to the tapered bore , once the puller is in place, and tightened up. When I worked as a mechanic, we had a standard procedure in these situations, if tightening and hammering on the centre bolt did not pop the gear (or bearing, sleeve, etc) off the shaft - we would use a oxy-acetelene torch to heat the bore. Usually, no hammer blows were required. With the centre bolt as tight as possible, the item would pop off on it's own, once the proper temp. was reached.
We found it more effective to heat only one section of the bore, (along it's complete length, if possible), instead of trying to heat around the entire circumfrence. The theory was to make the bore go "oblong", while at the same time preventing the heat from reaching (and expanding)the shaft.
There is no mention of using heat to remove the flywheel in the Clymer manual, but I see nothing in the diagrams that can be harmed by using heat. Hopefully Mr. Morley and others will comment on this. Good luck!
Miles

 

[gamorg02]

i picked up a jaw puller and a propane torch from the store. trying to get a few mins to head over there now.

 

[wildweasel_pt]

picking up on what Miles said i can shoot an idea in... the broken bolt was a M10 so you can tig weld a T shaped bar with about 6mm thick onto the broken face of the extractor and then you can heat up the surrounding area with a torch... heat it slowly so it can expand. Grab a can of ice spray on the store (used for sports muscular injuries - you know what im talking about) and when the surrounding area is warm and the T shaped twister is welded in place spray some ice directly onto the weld/extractor tip so it contracts and ease out the twisting force that you are applying at the same time... Try to give it a go... its cheap eitherway even if it doesn't work... I never did it on that specific part but its usual procedure... best of luck Garret

 

[gamorg02]

i don't have any access to welding equipment nor have I ever done it unfortunately.

update: no new news. the puller i drove all over gods green earth for was too small. the specs made ti sound like it was right on the money.

heres my 'flywheel holder' in action. and what i think about the puller!

 

[gamorg02]

Looking at what puller to use next. I'd like to get others opinions. I picked up part #1026. The arms dont' spread enough for the depth I need. Now in the attached table i think either of the next step up 1027 or 1037 would work, but can i go 'too big' here? I'm worried the 1037 may not fit under the flywheel to grab it, but it should be ok. If it fits is it best to go as big as I can? It doesn't have the 'reach' that the 1027 with the longer arms does though...

i have the flywheel measured to be roughly 5-3/4" x 2-1/2" with about 1/2-5/8" clearance between it and the starter clutch gear.

The 1037 on ebay here:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/OTC-...Z110157049902QQptZMotorsQ5fAutomotiveQ5fTools

is actually the same shop i picked up the 1026 that doesn't fit so maybe they will let me send it back and split the difference.

otherwise the 1027 is here:

http://cgi.ebay.com/5-Ton-Long-Reac...613?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3cb486c3e5

trying to get this done friday sometime so i can maybe have a puller by early next week.

thnx!

 

[Miles Long]

Looking at what puller to use next. I'd like to get others opinions. I picked up part #1026. The arms dont' spread enough for the depth I need. Now in the attached table i think either of the next step up 1027 or 1037 would work, but can i go 'too big' here? I'm worried the 1037 may not fit under the flywheel to grab it, but it should be ok. If it fits is it best to go as big as I can? It doesn't have the 'reach' that the 1027 with the longer arms does though...

i have the flywheel measured to be roughly 5-3/4" x 2-1/2" with about 1/2-5/8" clearance between it and the starter clutch gear.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/OTC-...Z110157049902QQptZMotorsQ5fAutomotiveQ5fTools

With pullers, the closer your attachment points are to the fitted/shrunk on section, the more efficient they are. This is why the original arrangement, with the plate-type puller, is the O.E.M. suggested method. But with the broken-off stud, a plate puller cannot be used. But maybe so........
Another idea. Again, I have no personal experience, just going by the photos and the Clymer manual.
The photos of the flywheel show 6 equidistant holes thru the outer diameter of the wheel (I suppose for lightening purposes?) - are these holes accessible from the back? i.e., "with about 1/2"-5/8" clearance"
It looks like they are. Page 141 of the Clymer, figure 41, shows the back of the flywheel with the starter clutch assembly still attached. The clutch assembly appears to be about 1/2" thick, which accounts for the clearance between the wheel and the clutch gear.
If this is correct, your'e back in business! Forget about a jaw-type puller, make yourself a heavy-duty plate type. This would involve making six pieces of steel plate, as thick as possible (1/2"-5/8") which can be slipped behind the flywheel, inline with the holes. Each plate has a tapped hole in it, using the largest diameter posible(looks like 1/2"?) Instead of making plates, you may be able to use heavy-wall nuts, if there is enough room to slip these in. But plates would be better - more contact area.
With these in place, now you have attachment points for your hardened puller bolts. Next you make a matching "backing" plate, out of 1/2" thick metal (the thicker the better), with 6 thru-holes, to match the diameter of the puller bolts. Because the flywheel holes are at the outer diameter of the wheel, the puller bolts/backing plate assembly has to be long enough to extend well beyond the outer face of the wheel,(to allow clearance for the flywheel, when it pops off) and the backing plate will consequently be of bigger diameter as well.
Now all that remains is a tapped hole, as large as possible (5/8"- 3/4"?), in the centre of the backing plate. Use a fine thread tap (and bolt of course), if possible. Less chance of pulling the threads out, when in use. Then assemble all to the flywheel, tighten as much as possible , and give the removal bolt a good whack. Tighten again, whack again, etc., until the flywheel pops. As mentioned previously,use heat, but as a last resort. A six-bolt plate puller should do the trick!
I realize all this fabrication, and the materials needed, may be beyond the capabililities of your own workshop, but this would all be "a snap" for any machine shop. I can't imagine the fabrication time being more than a couple hours. But this would save the cost of purchasing another jawed puller, which may not work.
Cheers, Miles