WTF is wrong withe people

[ouchez]

Do your homework and go google "subprime" and then come back again to extend your apologies to the euro trash... It all started on your neighborhood... When you don't know what you are talking about its better not to come to a public forum and show everybody what ignorance is all about... I see my self as a polite person but sometimes i have to talk in the same language to be understood... Sorry if i sound a bit unfriendly but i just like things to be clear when less than accurate things are being said...

Well i'll do that search for you...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subprime_mortgage_crisis

Weasel,

Do your own research as I do everyday, googling is handy but often used by the lazy. Europe is in Fiscal crisis and on the brink from wild spending and cradle to grave social programs and a people, except the Germans, that care to play far more than work. A welfare state throughout.

Our Mortgage scams took the US down, not specifically Europe. Our fed paid off your banks that were hurt, as they were also greedy as the American scammers.

O

 

[NHVmaxpower]

Why are we arguing political bull ****? Keep political views on another thread. This has nothing to do with those innocent people Who lost there lives. !!!!!!

 

[AMechEng]

Here comes 2nd amendment again... One thing is true, i don't see these school killing sprees anywhere else in the planet. And i do think gun control is important. And im in the military. I can have all the guns i want (being a military) and i have none. When guns are flowing freen in the market its much easier for a thug to get one. Theres always someone that will trade a gun for a handfull of dollars whether its legal or not... In portugal for you to have a gun you have to apply for an evaluation done by the police and you need to justify why you want to have a gun. Usually here to protect ourselves we have the police. Another thing is that i cannot kill a burglar inside my house, its the principle of unbalanced threat. If he threatens me with a knife inside my house and i shoot him im going to jail. It looks crazy but thats the way it is.

Another thing gun control will not keep the guns from the obeying citizens only. With less guns running around the perps won't be able to access them so easily. Even an obeying citizen can sell a gun to a stranger when money is needed... No one here can buy a gun. No one can sell it without going through strict scrutiny... Look at me in the states some 7 years ago with a Dirty Harry look... LOL

There are crazy people all over the World, this is not strictly a US problem. The Chinese school knife attack is a prime example:
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-202_162-57559179/china-school-knife-attack-leaves-23-injured/
Here is a case from Russia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beslan_school_hostage_crisis
Criminals will always finds ways to get guns. Here is an example that just happened where teens burglarized a state law enforcement officers house looking for money and guns.
http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/n...-in-police-dog-drakes-shooting-to-be-c/nTJWq/
As far as someone desperately needing money who owns guns legally and selling to a criminal for fast cash:
There are pawn shops all over the US that trade in guns and will buy any legally owned gun that comes into the store so this argument is mute. All guns have serial numbers that are registered to a owner so to sell a legally owned gun to a criminal who intends to use it in the commission of a crime would likely result in attorneys fees orders of magnitude more than the proceedings obtained from the illegal transaction.
Addressing home invasion and home defense- if someone enters an occupied dwelling the odds are that they are there to commit a violent crime against the occupants. To say that the home owner does not have the right to defend their family sounds crazy because it is crazy.
BTW for those not familiar with the Bath School Disaster look it up. It happened in 1927 and to this day is the third deadliest massacre in US history. Unfortunately these kind of things are not new. Still, as hardened as I have become to the news, I cried yesterday as I first heard the news around 3 pm.
One last thing- I feel it is in bad taste to discuss politics of any kind so soon after such a horrific event so for this I apologize.

 

[NHVmaxpower]

Call me crazy but I'm wondering if these shooters have had mental issues all there lives then playing all these killing video games and then they take fake to real life? Does something click in there head that makes them go from gaming to reality? When I grew up we played outdoors built tree forts etc and never had these killings.What is causing these young people to go on a killing spree in the last 15-20 years??

 

[wildweasel_pt]

Why are we arguing political bull ****? Keep political views on another thread. This has nothing to do with those innocent people Who lost there lives. !!!!!!

You are right. My apologies for going offtrack... All my sentiments to those who lost family members and got hurt...

 

[sdt354]

OK- more information out... The guns were stolden. No gun control law (outside of totally outlawing ALL guns) would have prevented this. Frankly, I don't think anything would have stopped it, because this guy would no doubt have found a way.

WE can't put police in every school, but most schools a few gun owners among their staff. IF they were to get the proper training, and they were allowed to carry concealed things would be different.

I have carried for over 40 years. One time in that 40 years that has saved my butt. I have never had to discharge my weapon. A couple of months ago my best fried and I were eating when two people came in. one stood by the cash drawer while the other walked to the back and returned. We both though something was going to go down. I believe that the guy walking around saw the nose of my 1911 showing under my shirt, and changed his mind. After they left, the manager came over and thanked us saying "We were counting on you guys" We weren't the only ones that thought something was about to go down.

The issue I have with teachers armed, unless non-lethal? It would be too easy to disarm a teacher. The teachers would be the first target of a gunman and be unable to help in any way in a mass shooting. The teachers have a hard enough job already in a lot of schools. A teacher would have to be thinking about the security of their weapon all the time. How about high power non-lethal weapons? Taze everyone in an area if you need to. Like pulling a fire alarm and everyone in an area is disabled temporarily but not killed. It beats the alternative of bullets flying. I suppose the ACLU would fight that to the end. I like the idea of foreign aid money used to fund it. Stop sending our money to the ingrates that criticize us after we gave lives and huge resources to let them NOT be a part of Nazi Germany or Japan!
Steve-o

 

[mr.maxx]

Ya, that is the answer, more violence on little kids,,,Great thinking.:bang head:


O

its called discipline......there is a difference

Great system,,now HOW do you suggest we pay for it??? Would you agree with my idea in a previous post to pay for it?

O

easy to pay for.......stop building schools as architectural masterpieces and build them for function. take that 40 grand spent on fancy landscaping and use it for security.

 

[srk468]

The issue I have with teachers armed, unless non-lethal? It would be too easy to disarm a teacher. The teachers would be the first target of a gunman and be unable to help in any way in a mass shooting. The teachers have a hard enough job already in a lot of schools. A teacher would have to be thinking about the security of their weapon all the time. How about high power non-lethal weapons? Taze everyone in an area if you need to. Like pulling a fire alarm and everyone in an area is disabled temporarily but not killed. It beats the alternative of bullets flying. I suppose the ACLU would fight that to the end. I like the idea of foreign aid money used to fund it. Stop sending our money to the ingrates that criticize us after we gave lives and huge resources to let them NOT be a part of Nazi Germany or Japan!
Steve-o

If a teacher wanted to carry for the protection of themselves and of the children then they should have to get training which should be offered for free (already is being offered free at a few places here in MI) and it should have to be concealed because there is no doubt it would be a disruption of the learning process. I see no problem with the people you trust your kids to everyday to have the means to protect them. Not a dig on you Steve, just stating my opinion....

 

[CustomMax]

Maybe the US govornment should pay for the systems that we install and most schools do get govornment funds for security instead of giving money to the unappreciative country's that badmouth the US just like some guys here and let them figure their own financial problems. After all the KIDS are the most important issue we all should address. Just wonder, of those poor innocent children did a future president die yesterday or maybe a future scientist that would cure cancer!! Guess we'll never know. It breaks my heart when an innocent child loses their life because some spoiled little **** didn't get a pony when he was young or whatever stupid ******* reason. GUNS don't kill! People do! Taking guns from the people would not only NEVER happen anyone who blames the guns is living in fantasy land. Sorry, there are answers for these issues but it just takes those in charge to make these issues a priority more than worrying about other country's and their problems. LET THEM FIGURE IT OUT FOR THEMSELVES. We have to and NOBODY bails us out. It is so dumb to blame the guns cause if he drove a car into the bldg and killed a bunch of people would these same people want to ban cars? I mean, be real.

 

[Itgoes]

+100, very well stated.

Thousands of guns here in the North East used in crimes have been traced backed to States like Virginia, that have "lax" gun laws IMO.

More guns.....is more guns - and that means more for the criminals.

Why people would be against a waiting period, permits, mandatory gun owner training, an assault "type" weapon restriction....... has always baffled me.

Here comes 2nd amendment again... One thing is true, i don't see these school killing sprees anywhere else in the planet. And i do think gun control is important. And im in the military. I can have all the guns i want (being a military) and i have none. When guns are flowing freen in the market its much easier for a thug to get one. Theres always someone that will trade a gun for a handfull of dollars whether its legal or not... In portugal for you to have a gun you have to apply for an evaluation done by the police and you need to justify why you want to have a gun. Usually here to protect ourselves we have the police. Another thing is that i cannot kill a burglar inside my house, its the principle of unbalanced threat. If he threatens me with a knife inside my house and i shoot him im going to jail. It looks crazy but thats the way it is.

Another thing gun control will not keep the guns from the obeying citizens only. With less guns running around the perps won't be able to access them so easily. Even an obeying citizen can sell a gun to a stranger when money is needed... No one here can buy a gun. No one can sell it without going through strict scrutiny... Look at me in the states some 7 years ago with a Dirty Harry look... LOL

 

[sdt354]

If a teacher wanted to carry for the protection of themselves and of the children then they should have to get training which should be offered for free (already is being offered free at a few places here in MI) and it should have to be concealed because there is no doubt it would be a disruption of the learning process. I see no problem with the people you trust your kids to everyday to have the means to protect them. Not a dig on you Steve, just stating my opinion....

No offense taken Opinions always welcome as far as I'm concerned SR.
Steve-o

 

[sdt354]

its called discipline......there is a difference




easy to pay for.......stop building schools as architectural masterpieces and build them for function. take that 40 grand spent on fancy landscaping and use it for security.

You should take a look at the public schools. They aren't all built like the Taj Mahal. In fact they are crumbling in a lot of places everywhere.

 

[ZackDaniels]

Why people would be against a waiting period, permits, mandatory gun owner training, an assault "type" weapon restriction....... has always baffled me.

It's viewed as a slippery slope. Increasing regs and requiring training or additional permits artificially increases the cost of owning and maintaining guns. At some point it will get too expensive to own and thus :damn angry: 2nd amendment :damn angry:.

Personally I'm OK with dropping a few bucks more on a hobby if it saves lives and better educates people. Motorcycle endorsements cost $10 more in Illinois than they need to because it goes to fund state sponsored MSF classes. People in this state can take the basic riders course for free thanks to that extra $10 per rider. That's one government fee I'm quite happy to pay for, and the same applies for anything that makes the average gun owner more responsible and their friends and family safer.

Lots of folks don't view it as a hobby though, and that's where additional costs become such a slight. Add a healthy dose of conspiracy theories being pushed out by advocacy groups and you have what we have now. Lobbying groups who get paid money to fight regulations don't advertise this as better education and making people safer, they advertise it as threatening the very way of life and big government overstepping their bounds. They get more things to lobby against and more funding that way.

 

[srk468]

If your willing to go for the training and already have a carry permit then a waiting period is pretty redundant if you ask me. If your keep a gun in your home then there should be no required training either, it's really easy to keep adding things to where the average person can't afford it. The improperly named "assault weapons" you speak of are used in a fraction of a percent of crime, we actually did have a ban on them for a decade and it did NOTHING to reduce crime and was strictly "feel good" legislation. People are the problem, not the guns and law abiding people should not be punished for the acts of these cowards. I'm not saying there should be no gun laws because this isn't the 50's anymore but we already have more than enough...

 

[Redbone]

It's viewed as a slippery slope. Increasing regs and requiring training or additional permits artificially increases the cost of owning and maintaining guns. At some point it will get too expensive to own and thus :damn angry: 2nd amendment :damn angry:.
Yeah, that pesky second amendment is a:damn angry: problem :damn angry:for a lot of people.

Personally I'm OK with dropping a few bucks more on a hobby if it saves lives and better educates people. Motorcycle endorsements cost $10 more in Illinois than they need to because it goes to fund state sponsored MSF classes. People in this state can take the basic riders course for free thanks to that extra $10 per rider. That's one government fee I'm quite happy to pay for, and the same applies for anything that makes the average gun owner more responsible and their friends and family safer.

Lots of folks don't view it as a hobby though, and that's where additional costs become such a slight. Add a healthy dose of conspiracy theories being pushed out by advocacy groups and you have what we have now. Lobbying groups who get paid money to fight regulations don't advertise this as better education and making people safer, they advertise it as threatening the very way of life and big government overstepping their bounds. They get more things to lobby against and more funding that way.

I'm sure your aware that there is an opposing lobby groups that is just as well funded to lobby against the groups that support the second amendment. And of course you do recognize all that the work the NRA does with youth/ first timers on gun safety training?
I also do not have any issue with the waiting period to get be able to take ownership on a gun.

 

[cgswss]

+100, very well stated.

Why people would be against a waiting period, permits, mandatory gun owner training, an assault "type" weapon restriction....... has always baffled me.

First, Waiting periods have been tried and don?t do anything but make it more inconvenient for honest gun buyers. The logic behind a waiting period is that it will cut down on ?crimes of passion?. You know like you have a fight with your X and get so mad you drive out to the gun store and buy a gun to go shoot her. Violent crime with guns when UP after the waiting period was put in effect.

Training. Right now if you want to carry your firearm, in most states you have to go thru both classroom and on range training. This is designed to be a two day course, but if you are willing to get up real early and stay late, you can get it done in one day. There is a bill in congress, supported by the NRA and other pro gun groups to make this universal across the US.

Assault weapons. This is a little like the so called ?Saturday Night Special? of years ago. How do you define an assault weapon. The way the Democrats define it is a very big problem. According to the ?assault weapon? bill they have drafted

?`(L) A rifle or shotgun originally designed for military or law enforcement use, or a firearm based on the design of such a firearm?

OK- there goes about every rifle and most shotguns in the world. Remember the bolt action M98 was the ?assault rifle? of World War One, which would outlaw every bolt action rifle in the world. The Pump Shotgun would also be outlawed.

But they also go after pistols as ?assault weapons?.

? `(F) A semiautomatic pistol that has the ability to accept a detachable magazine, and has--
`(i) a second pistol grip;
`(ii) a threaded barrel;
`(iii) a barrel shroud; or
`(iv) the capacity to accept a detachable magazine at a location outside of the pistol grip.?
If you read that, you realize that this part of their Assault weapons bill outlaws about every semi auto pistol in the world. The key part is (iv)- you load semi auto pistol from the bottom of the grip. How can you make it unable to accept a larger (longer) magazine?
On top of that, we had an assault weapon ban (that also outlawed mags over 10 round). Then that ban was put in place, violent crime increased. The year after the ban expired the murder rate decreased and stayed below the 2004 rate (last year of the ban) since.
We hear a lot about the shootings a Columbine. There were seven people there that day that had taken the training and had legal permits to carry concealed, but they were not allowed to carry their weapons on campus. There are three people that were in the theater during the shooting that were discussing suing the theater because they had carry permits, but were not allowed to take their guns into the building.
And remember EVERY person that buys a gun from a dealer goes thru an FBI background check. This includes dealers at gun shows.

 

[srk468]

This stinks like **** more and more day by day, your not gonna be laughing and smiling when your child was just murdered... Also posting an interesting picture, I don't know what happened... I just KNOW it's not what they are telling us!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=cKWgCRBR5qE

 

[VMax-Mike]

The said thing is this is for the most part forgoten. I still think it would be a bad deal for teachers to have guns on them in the schools. I have almost droped my gun a few times going to the bathroom and now i set it aside until im done. i have never left it behind but i have started to walk away. I have put it in the glove box because i could not keep it on me and left it until the next day. If you carrie often enough you will catch yourself ******* up. I have and luckly i cought myself. Are the teachers going to catch themselves ******* up or is a kid going to catch them ******* up. Alot of what ifs could happen with guns in schools. Saidly to say the best thing is to not make a martyr out of the killer and go on with your everday life so that the next killer wont try to top it. Killers are born everyday and to try and stop them is like bush saying he will get rid of all the terrorist. Its impossible. Anyone could be one. Life it self can change people. Hell money and power can make people do bad things.

 

[Rusty McNeil]

I sort of agree on the teacher/gun thing. Accident waiting to happen. Leave it out or accessible though a brain fart or whatnot.

I had a ******* panic attack flying out of San Jose before Christmas.
Besides the fact that California laws turn me into an instant felon when I enter the state driving with my handgun, and then stays in the motel room.

I packed all my stuff up before leaving for Christmas and had a bag to go on the plane with me and the other bags to leave in my truck at the airport over Christmas.

I'm watching my carry on suitcase go into the X-ray machine and suddenly for the life of me could not remember positively if I had put the gun in the correct suitcase to leave in the truck, and NOT the one I was taking with me. I was tired and burnt out when packing the night before.
It was the most anxious 2 minutes in a very long time while that suitcase went through the scanner.
Luckily I got it right.
I now understand how TSA pops a couple thousand honest well meaning citizens a year for bringing a gun thru security.
Mistakes do happen but the consequences can be severe, just as it could be with some gun toting teacher v

 

[dannymax]

I sort of agree on the teacher/gun thing. Accident waiting to happen. Leave it out or accessible though a brain fart or whatnot.

I had a ******* panic attack flying out of San Jose before Christmas.
Besides the fact that California laws turn me into an instant felon when I enter the state driving with my handgun, and then stays in the motel room.

I packed all my stuff up before leaving for Christmas and had a bag to go on the plane with me and the other bags to leave in my truck at the airport over Christmas.

I'm watching my carry on suitcase go into the X-ray machine and suddenly for the life of me could not remember positively if I had put the gun in the correct suitcase to leave in the truck, and NOT the one I was taking with me. I was tired and burnt out when packing the night before.
It was the most anxious 2 minutes in a very long time while that suitcase went through the scanner.
Luckily I got it right.
I now understand how TSA pops a couple thousand honest well meaning citizens a year for bringing a gun thru security.
Mistakes do happen but the consequences can be severe, just as it could be with some gun toting teacher v

Oh man! I could feel my pulse get a little quicker reading this Rusty!! It's sooo friggin' easy to do, but sooo hard to explain!!