three percent the truth

[caseyjones955]

Even ANTIFA knows better than to bring a Vagina Suit to a gun fight...lol

Do they though? Do they really?

I have so far avoided taking shots at any individual here. But if any male here has donned a snatch hat or belongs to ANTIFA and has the balls to fess up I'll cut you down to the bone (verbally only of course). Even when someone refereed to our first lady as the "epitome of classy", I almost choked on my tongue laughing so hard but I refrained from returning fire on a personal basis. I'm not easy to troll me, but here it is, fess up to any of the above and see how much love is in the room.

Common sense is a concept that has long been abandoned by the Left. For 18 months I civilly tried to talk with them and all I got was called named, insulted, blah blah blah... I finally had enough of their collective anal ******** and just said, "Stay out of my life and we won't have a problem. Don't and you will have a MAJOR problem you will NOT be able to cope with. Since then, this thread is the closest I've come to getting back into a political debate. However as the next election draws near, I'm sure I'll be getting back into it full on.... We could shove all the Liberals into the Grand Canyon or Pacific Ocean and it wouldn't bother be one bit. My biggest question is why hasn't the CDC declared Liberalism a certified brain disorder.... there can be NO other explanation.

I agree, but I'll tailor my response not to all liberals, only to the militant liberals.
If you talk too much common sense, or in any way advocate for personal responsibility, or fail to pander to the extra-delicate then you would be dubbed a misogynist racist hater. IE, support Trump = ignorant racist hater. It's a blanket response used in the absence of any logical argument. I'm so ******* glad I don't live in CA where this is an everyday thing. I'm glad to see there are still some thinking adults in the world fighting to keep us from falling into complete socialism.

 

[Kronx]

Man there is some hilarious **** in this thread. I can't decide which one is my favorite.

Liberals love big gov't. Conservative are small gov't:
-The largest expansion of the federal government in our lifetimes was under a Republican president with formation of the Department of Homeland Security

Liberals believe they are smarter than anyone else. This one is hilarious. Lemme hit you with some of Donald Trump's "I know more than anyone..."
-"I know more about ISIS than the generals do." Nov 2015
-"I know more about courts than any human being on Earth." Nov 2015
-"Nobody knows more about trade than me." March 2016
-"I know more about renewable energy than any human being on Earth." April 2016
-"Nobody knows more about technology than me." Dec 2018

But the one that really cracks me up is Liberals are egotistical elites. I answer that one with a photo.

None of this is to claim one side is better than the other. Nor am I trying to "both sides" anything. It's to point out the lack of self awareness.

 

[caseyjones955]

HI Big tuff Guys with big balls and SMALL Pe-..s same as the Potus I believe ....(Fake news ??)
You Always weining about Hillary and Socialist but You dont know anything outside your 10 mile Territory......
Sleep well with Your Guns beside You in bed... We in this Country are still capable to have something else there and much better life!!!
//Lars

I'm sincerely glad you like your country, I'm sure I would to would I visit, but we have it pretty sweet over here too. Just because we love our guns does not mean we enjoy a lower quality of life, actually to the contrary it's a great hobby as well as a very effective deterrent for those with ill intent. I enjoy those from other cultures and like to experience as much of it as I can but I'm American through and through and make no excuses or apologies for our love for guns. It's why we still enjoy such a high degree of autonomy and freedom compared to many of our Euro and Asian counterparts. Peace.

 

[GuruedVMax]

How is not? You have a right to have a firearm. You're not required to have a firearm. That's actually different than requiring an ID to vote. That's the distinction. Today people are required to register to vote. Same as you have to register a firearm. As far as a "cover charge" for a firearm. That probably depends on the state. There's never been "cover charge" for them in any of the states I've lived in. But I admit Im not familiar with all states gun laws.

You have to show a photo ID to legally purchase any firearm in any state. It should be no less to register to vote. Anyone who is against a photo ID to register to vote, OR, to present said photo ID when they vote, is intending on somehow cheating. It doesn't take a high double digit IQ to figure that one out. If you are against photo IDs to vote then it is only because of intentions to somehow cheat..... nothing more need be said.

 

[Kronx]

Why does every country across the pond want the U.S. to dis arm it's citizens??

“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime.” - Mark Twain

I've been fortunate to not only travel and work in a lot of states in the US, but also around the world. If you actually talk to people in different countries, you might find its not that they want the US to disarm its citizens, it's ultimately curiosity to our lack of empathy towards our own citizens. How we let someone walk into a school and paint the walls with the blood of 20 first graders and not only do we not do anything about it. We claim the grieving parents and classmates are paid crisis actors. There is an undercurrent of cruelty and violence towards other Americans that we take pride in that the rest of the world finds curious.

Just look at the comments on the last few pages of this thread towards liberals. They're a disease, terrorists, etc. Heard it all my life. As I posted previously in this thread. I grew up where the saying was "The only good liberal is a dead liberal." That's been such a common thread in the Republican discourse for all of my life: "Death to Liberals." You've also got a lot of violent rhetoric from the left as well. Rappers making songs about killing cops. Liberal comedians with photos of Trump's head. People with Obama dummies hanging from their trees in their yard. America is so numb to all the violent rhetoric we forget it how violent it can be to someone who doesn't live here.

 

[Kronx]

You have to show a photo ID to legally purchase any firearm in any state. It should be no less to register to vote. Anyone who is against a photo ID to register to vote, OR, to present said photo ID when they vote, is intending on somehow cheating. It doesn't take a high double digit IQ to figure that one out. If you are against photo IDs to vote then it is only because of intentions to somehow cheat..... nothing more need be said.

We're talking about two different rights. Not all rules are going to apply. Photo ID is to buy a gun. Not own one. I didn't have to show my photo ID when I inherited my grandfathers guns. Heck Missouri doesn't even require you to register your guns anymore. But you have to register to vote. I think I made it clear I had no problems with a photo ID depending on how it was implemented.

 

[rebeltaz83]

“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime.” - Mark Twain

I've been fortunate to not only travel and work in a lot of states in the US, but also around the world. If you actually talk to people in different countries, you might find its not that they want the US to disarm its citizens, it's ultimately curiosity to our lack of empathy towards our own citizens. How we let someone walk into a school and paint the walls with the blood of 20 first graders and not only do we not do anything about it. We claim the grieving parents and classmates are paid crisis actors. There is an undercurrent of cruelty and violence towards other Americans that we take pride in that the rest of the world finds curious.

Just look at the comments on the last few pages of this thread towards liberals. They're a disease, terrorists, etc. Heard it all my life. As I posted previously in this thread. I grew up where the saying was "The only good liberal is a dead liberal." That's been such a common thread in the Republican discourse for all of my life: "Death to Liberals." You've also got a lot of violent rhetoric from the left as well. Rappers making songs about killing cops. Liberal comedians with photos of Trump's head. People with Obama dummies hanging from their trees in their yard. America is so numb to all the violent rhetoric we forget it how violent it can be to someone who doesn't live here.

I'd have to agree. I spent some time in Germany before politics got out of control 2009ish. The German I was working with was young, spoke English, and had family over here in the states. All he wanted was to move here, and become a citizen and be with his family. I've been ignorant on politics until 2016, and I still am, it doesn't interest me, and it's boring. I voted for Trump as the lesser of two evils. What I see is the far left and the far right swinging hammers driving a giant wedge to further divide our country. Neither are willing to compromise, and both think they are right. I dislike the far left, they disregard the Constitution, but yet cry when it gets used on them...... Same with the far right. They each have an agenda, trying to push, pry, and prod just to see how much we are willing to give up. I'm still outside of the whole politics crap, just what it is crap. They all lie, cheat, steal to get ahead. Do anything to put money in their pocket. To them living with enough money to just "get by" is the normal. But they cry when they feel they don't make enough money, and put a raise in the works so they can further the divide between poor and Rich. Being a politician shouldn't be a career........... Making our country better shouldn't put money their pocket, it should go into everybodys pocket. Term limits and watch how fast things change, but won't happen. It's easy money sitting on capital Hill, living in a bubble not having to deal with "reality" like the rest of the country. Politics put our country in the current position it's in, they don't seem to be doing much to change it. The deficit just keeps going up, up, and up jobs going over seas, homelessness, our infrastructure keeps crumbling, the left blames the right, the right blames the left............. Who's fault it's it?? They promise to "fix it" so we vote for them, and nothing gets fixed. It's always the same, lower taxes, higher wages, bring jobs back blah blah blah, just hot air. The only thing they do on capital Hill is convert oxygen to carbon dioxide, and take our tax money so they can live better, until we the people so something about it, it'll always be the same rhetoric from both sides of the spectrum. Nothing more than a playground dispute, Dems own the monkey bars, and rep. Have the swing set, it's stupid. They act like a bunch of 5 year olds that need their ass beat. I'm gonna go back in my hole, and live my life how I see fit.

 

[Kronx]

I'd have to agree. I spent some time in Germany before politics got out of control 2009ish. The German I was working with was young, spoke English, and had family over here in the states. All he wanted was to move here, and become a citizen and be with his family. I've been ignorant on politics until 2016, and I still am, it doesn't interest me, and it's boring. I voted for Trump as the lesser of two evils. What I see is the far left and the far right swinging hammers driving a giant wedge to further divide our country. Neither are willing to compromise, and both think they are right. I dislike the far left, they disregard the Constitution, but yet cry when it gets used on them...... Same with the far right. They each have an agenda, trying to push, pry, and prod just to see how much we are willing to give up. I'm still outside of the whole politics crap, just what it is crap. They all lie, cheat, steal to get ahead. Do anything to put money in their pocket. To them living with enough money to just "get by" is the normal. But they cry when they feel they don't make enough money, and put a raise in the works so they can further the divide between poor and Rich. Being a politician shouldn't be a career........... Making our country better shouldn't put money their pocket, it should go into everybodys pocket. Term limits and watch how fast things change, but won't happen. It's easy money sitting on capital Hill, living in a bubble not having to deal with "reality" like the rest of the country. Politics put our country in the current position it's in, they don't seem to be doing much to change it. The deficit just keeps going up, up, and up jobs going over seas, homelessness, our infrastructure keeps crumbling, the left blames the right, the right blames the left............. Who's fault it's it?? They promise to "fix it" so we vote for them, and nothing gets fixed. It's always the same, lower taxes, higher wages, bring jobs back blah blah blah, just hot air. The only thing they do on capital Hill is convert oxygen to carbon dioxide, and take our tax money so they can live better, until we the people so something about it, it'll always be the same rhetoric from both sides of the spectrum. Nothing more than a playground dispute, Dems own the monkey bars, and rep. Have the swing set, it's stupid. They act like a bunch of 5 year olds that need their ass beat. I'm gonna go back in my hole, and live my life how I see fit.

I think we, the American citizens, have to take ownership and shoulder the blame as well to some degree. We're the ones putting these folks in office and then not holding them accountable. They're getting away with all of corruption because we allow them to get away with it. And we allow them to get away with it because at least half the country of eligible voters is disengaged. I'm not judging. It's just the reality. Most of America has a similar story as yours -- they just don't pay attention to politics. Folks have lives to live, jobs to do, so I get it. Then when folks do tune into politics they get discouraged, which then leads to them disengaging again. If the citizenry is not engaged with governance, then it should be no surprise representatives will run amok.

We've all seen the "man on the street" type interviews -- where random people are asked pretty simple questions. Like who is the vice president? Whose the governor of your state? Most people can't answer those basic questions. I'd bet a steak dinner if you pulled 100 random natural born Americans off the street, half of them would fail the citizenship test immigrants take. And that's exactly how the politicians want it -- they want people to be disengaged so they can keep getting away with it.

So what's the solution? Sadly, I don't think there is one any longer. Some things just have a point of no return and I think we've definitely crossed it. In my opinion, it will never get better. It's only going to get worse.

 

[dannymax]

So what's the solution? Sadly, I don't think there is one any longer. Some things just have a point of no return and I think we've definitely crossed it. In my opinion, it will never get better. It's only going to get worse.

Unfortunately, we agree on this point. Just have to make a good life out of what's available....or be pissed off and frustrated all the time...those are the choices. Me 'n my guns choose the first option. Peace

 

[caseyjones955]

Unfortunately, we agree on this point. Just have to make a good life out of what's available....or be pissed off and frustrated all the time...those are the choices. Me 'n my guns choose the first option. Peace

I like your positive outlook, but I hope you are wrong on the point of it not getting better. Honestly I would not bet either way but I'm hoping for some Darwinism to sort of weed out those who are intent on driving us into the dirt. I do believe it will get a bit worse before it gets any better.

It's possible that this is cyclical given the non-sustainable nature of the way things look like they are going. I'm holding onto the hope that it will improve, maybe not in my lifetime but at least in my children's lifetimes. Now with the age of internet we are able to get a glimpse (at least those willing to suss out quality journalism) of how this might go if we dont make wise choices as a society right now. Our leaders are pretty bad but if we look abroad we can see how much further down we could go. We didnt slip this far overnight and it wont get better overnight but the choices we make today, and how we guide our young will certainly impact what happens next, and mostly, next after that.

I hate to speak in bumper stickers but here it goes. There is nothing wrong with America that cant be fixed by whats right with America.

If nothing else could y'all at least teach your kids how to drive a manual trans so when everything else sucks we can still get vehicles with clutches and turbos... Thanks! haha.

 

[rynoman]

How is not? You have a right to have a firearm. You're not required to have a firearm. That's actually different than requiring an ID to vote. That's the distinction. Today people are required to register to vote. Same as you have to register a firearm. As far as a "cover charge" for a firearm. That probably depends on the state. There's never been "cover charge" for them in any of the states I've lived in. But I admit Im not familiar with all states gun laws.

Okay, on your voter registration point. What process would you propose that would allow citizens of OUR country to vote for OUR elected officials in OUR elections? Seriously, I am not being, sarcastic, facetious, or rhetorical. Just a sincere question with constructive intent. I know I don't want to make the process any harder for people than it has to be, as it would also discourage folks with my political leanings from making it to the polls. But, there HAS to be a vetting of who is voting or the election is 100% meaningless. It would just be a giant expensive dog and pony show.

On the firearms licensing, I can personally tell you that if you live in California and you want to purchase a hand gun (I think now even a long gun), you will have to pay (the state) for a BFSC (which I would be in favor of except that it's an absolute joke). I think it's $30.00. Then you pay another $30.00 for a background check and that starts the "waiting period". After the waiting period you have 10 days to pick up the firearm. If you let the 10 days expire before you pick it up, you have to start the process all over again with the exception of the Basic Firearm Safety Course.

I possessed a CCW in California. It cost me right at $600.00 to acquire it and about $350 every two years to preserve it. Along with the cost, time, and bother of at least two trips to the County Sheriff's office and a full day spent at a training course. I understand New York is almost impossible.

 

[caseyjones955]

Okay, on your voter registration point. What process would you propose that would allow citizens of OUR country to vote for OUR elected officials in OUR elections? Seriously, I am not being, sarcastic, facetious, or rhetorical. Just a sincere question with constructive intent. I know I don't want to make the process any harder for people than it has to be, as it would also discourage folks with my political leanings from making it to the polls. But, there HAS to be a vetting of who is voting or the election is 100% meaningless. It would just be a giant expensive dog and pony show.

On the firearms licensing, I can personally tell you that if you live in California and you want to purchase a hand gun (I think now even a long gun), you will have to pay (the state) for a BFSC (which I would be in favor of except that it's an absolute joke). I think it's $30.00. Then you pay another $30.00 for a background check and that starts the "waiting period". After the waiting period you have 10 days to pick up the firearm. If you let the 10 days expire before you pick it up, you have to start the process all over again with the exception of the Basic Firearm Safety Course.

I possessed a CCW in California. It cost me right at $600.00 to acquire it and about $350 every two years to preserve it. Along with the cost, time, and bother of at least two trips to the County Sheriff's office and a full day spent at a training course. I understand New York is almost impossible.

OUCH!!

I had one in WA, there were several flaming hoops and a good deal of expense, but not like that, wow. SD is $10 at the courthouse, you get it in the mail a few days later once they decide your not a felon. Renewal is $10 (last I checked). I'm unaware of any registration requirements, not saying I would comply if there were. Anyone knows it's probably a good idea to have a few pieces off the papers just in case. I think SD just became an open carry state recently, no permit required unless you do conceal, which I often do and have the permit. It seems outrageous to have to spend so much damn money to exercise a constitutionally guaranteed right, especially since all their steps seem not to be helping curb gun violence. CA is known for abusing tax payers though, just like WA to a lesser degree. I suspect the huge cost and hassle associated with having a CA CCW probably sees many folks buying and carrying illegally when they would otherwise go through the legal channels.

I think a basic state ID would be still at a normal cost, but a voter ID free of charge and not good for anything else (including alcohol/tobacco purchases) would be a bargain for taxpayers just to make sure the actual vote belongs to the person casting it. I agree that it is absurd to not have to show photo ID to vote, and that ID for voting only should be free, ideally. But also taxes are supposed to be easy to pay, but in reality they can be anything but. There is often quite a chasm between what should be and what is. As a tax payer I would not mind flipping the bill for an ID only good for voting. We pay for much more for far greater absurdities, many of which serve the citizens not one bit.

 

[wacokid]

And yet any 18 yo idiot with a voter reg card can vote your rights away, i.e. increase guv power, increase your taxes, vote for mofreeshit, yeah, which one is more dangerous???

I cannot exercise my right to protect myself without paying the state to do so “legally”. ********, one and all.

A duct taped banana was recently valued at $120k. This banana republic is pretty close to worth a shot o Brawndo and a women’s studies degree.

 

[rynoman]

OUCH!!

I had one in WA, there were several flaming hoops and a good deal of expense, but not like that, wow. SD is $10 at the courthouse, you get it in the mail a few days later once they decide your not a felon. Renewal is $10 (last I checked). I'm unaware of any registration requirements, not saying I would comply if there were. Anyone knows it's probably a good idea to have a few pieces off the papers just in case. I think SD just became an open carry state recently, no permit required unless you do conceal, which I often do and have the permit. It seems outrageous to have to spend so much damn money to exercise a constitutionally guaranteed right, especially since all their steps seem not to be helping curb gun violence. CA is known for abusing tax payers though, just like WA to a lesser degree. I suspect the huge cost and hassle associated with having a CA CCW probably sees many folks buying and carrying illegally when they would otherwise go through the legal channels.

I think a basic state ID would be still at a normal cost, but a voter ID free of charge and not good for anything else (including alcohol/tobacco purchases) would be a bargain for taxpayers just to make sure the actual vote belongs to the person casting it. I agree that it is absurd to not have to show photo ID to vote, and that ID for voting only should be free, ideally. But also taxes are supposed to be easy to pay, but in reality they can be anything but. There is often quite a chasm between what should be and what is. As a tax payer I would not mind flipping the bill for an ID only good for voting. We pay for much more for far greater absurdities, many of which serve the citizens not one bit.

Yep. Just one of the many reasons I moved my family out of that leftist **** hole (The People's Republic of California). Idaho is a "shall issue" state but you don't need one as long as your 18 years of age and not otherwise disqualified from being able to possess a firearm. It's also an open carry state. America!! Yes sir, your right about Washington. And Oregon too. Just look at people voting with their feet and leaving those states. I can personally attest that plenty of people do conceal carry without a permit in CA due to the onerous task of obtaining one.

 

[Kronx]

Okay, on your voter registration point. What process would you propose that would allow citizens of OUR country to vote for OUR elected officials in OUR elections? Seriously, I am not being, sarcastic, facetious, or rhetorical. Just a sincere question with constructive intent. I know I don't want to make the process any harder for people than it has to be, as it would also discourage folks with my political leanings from making it to the polls. But, there HAS to be a vetting of who is voting or the election is 100% meaningless. It would just be a giant expensive dog and pony show.

On the firearms licensing, I can personally tell you that if you live in California and you want to purchase a hand gun (I think now even a long gun), you will have to pay (the state) for a BFSC (which I would be in favor of except that it's an absolute joke). I think it's $30.00. Then you pay another $30.00 for a background check and that starts the "waiting period". After the waiting period you have 10 days to pick up the firearm. If you let the 10 days expire before you pick it up, you have to start the process all over again with the exception of the Basic Firearm Safety Course.

I possessed a CCW in California. It cost me right at $600.00 to acquire it and about $350 every two years to preserve it. Along with the cost, time, and bother of at least two trips to the County Sheriff's office and a full day spent at a training course. I understand New York is almost impossible.

The challenge of a voter ID system IMO is striking the balance of actual validation and personal privacy/independence. With any sort of system design if someone wants to exploit it, they'll figure out a way to do it. Your concern is voter ID. I understand. I have just as big of concern of voting machine accuracy and data security from end to end. So for me to address all of those concerns I'd like to see the ID be used in most steps of the process. I would also like to see a standardization of voting machines and systems. I'm not sure if you're familiar with what a CAC is but I'd probably use a system like that. It would have a photo and a unique identifier that is tied to you - like the chip in a credit card. So you show up to the poll and check in with your card. The person at the poll checks you in and selects the machine you'll go vote. That machine is then at the ready and will only accept your card with your ID in order to process the vote. This is to prevent a malicious person showing up with a pocket full of hacked cards. Put your card in the voting machine so it ties your vote to your ID for audit purposes. After you vote, the machine locks and will only allow the next voter defined by the polling check in person. It prints out a receipt of your votes for you and it has a unique transaction number on the receipt as well. You take the receipt with you. Then if there's any investigation/recount into voting systems or if you as a citizen has a concern your vote was manipulated in any way you can go back to the state, ask them to show what they have on record and reconcile it with your receipt. There's a bunch of stuff I'd like to see on the backend as well in regards to controlled access, encryption, audting, but that's boring IT stuff no one is interested in. There isn't a perfect system. I wish there was.

Yea it sounds like California is a pain in the ass. I'm not surprised. Sounds like you did the right thing by moving out. It's a ****** option, but sometimes we have to move to states that better align with our values. I personally have no problem with waiting periods for firearm purchases. But some things are certainly ridiculous. It took me 16 months, alot of paperwork and about $300 overall to get a suppressor for just one of my rifles several years ago in my effort to not go completely deaf from hunting. That's just stupid, but that was the most expensive tax/fee for me when it came to owning a firearm in Missouri. When I inherited my grandfathers weapons, a few he brought back from Germany from World War 2, there was no cost at all associated to it. I've purchased 4 firearms in Missouri at stores and gun shows. No waiting period. No background check fee. Just the price of the firearm. Missouri is probably one of the most pro-gun states in the country.

 

[Kronx]

And yet any 18 yo idiot with a voter reg card can vote your rights away, i.e. increase guv power, increase your taxes, vote for mofreeshit, yeah, which one is more dangerous???

I cannot exercise my right to protect myself without paying the state to do so “legally”. ********, one and all.

A duct taped banana was recently valued at $120k. This banana republic is pretty close to worth a shot o Brawndo and a women’s studies degree.

I understand your sentiment, but I'm of the opinion if an 18 yr old can die for their country then they're at the age where they get a say in its direction - whether I agree with that direction or not. There's a lot of ****** up logic in this country in regards to laws that doesn't make much sense. Hell, I grew up in a dry county where no alcohol was sold and my family ran moonshine. And even in the wet counties Mississippi wouldn't let you buy it on Sundays back in the 80s. Yet I could go across the state line and go to a drive thru beer barn. When me and some guys I served with were out of state I asked out loud "Is this a dry county?" And they were all like "What's a dry county?" When I told them they looked at my like I stepped out of a time machine from the prohibition.

 

[wacokid]

I understand your sentiment, but I'm of the opinion if an 18 yr old can die for their country then they're at the age where they get a say in its direction - whether I agree with that direction or not. There's a lot of ****** up logic in this country in regards to laws that doesn't make much sense. Hell, I grew up in a dry county where no alcohol was sold and my family ran moonshine. And even in the wet counties Mississippi wouldn't let you buy it on Sundays back in the 80s. Yet I could go across the state line and go to a drive thru beer barn. When me and some guys I served with were out of state I asked out loud "Is this a dry county?" And they were all like "What's a dry county?" When I told them they looked at my like I stepped out of a time machine from the prohibition.

I’m Fine with that. Mil ID and they vote at 18. Otherwise, it’s 21 to buy beer. 21 to buy a handgun. 21 to vote.

See where I’m going with this??? If one is not grown up enough to make a decision regarding the consumption of alcohol or possession of a handgun, then they are definitely not responsible enough to make an informed decision to vote for, or against, my liberties...

 

[caseyjones955]

Yep. Just one of the many reasons I moved my family out of that leftist **** hole (The People's Republic of California). Idaho is a "shall issue" state but you don't need one as long as your 18 years of age and not otherwise disqualified from being able to possess a firearm. It's also an open carry state. America!! Yes sir, your right about Washington. And Oregon too. Just look at people voting with their feet and leaving those states. I can personally attest that plenty of people do conceal carry without a permit in CA due to the onerous task of obtaining one.

Once again CA shoots themselves in the foot with counterproductive policy and law. Seems they are intent on taxing and regulating many industries and individuals right out the door. They not only fail to protect tax payers, they are overtly hostile to them. CA has spread almost all the way north up the left coast. I was born in SoCal, dad passed in late 70s when I was still young, and it wasnt two weeks later CA was in our rear view mirror for good. There were a lot of people leaving WA when I left in 05 too, but so many more flooding in from CA that the population grew immensely in the time I was there. Many of them were pretty alright but many others brought their California ways with them and ****** up the whole western chunk of the state.

I fear ID is in danger of the same thing. My favorite cuz lives in Nampa valley, I often hear in vivid detail how it has changed in recent years. Thankfully ID is still full of great scenery and state law is still reasonable. It's probably more vital than ever to encourage those you know to be active voters in that area to prevent further damage from a leftward shift. Political leanings aside there are just soooo ******* many people on the west coast that it's unlivable. There is no getting away, the overcrowding and traffic are soul crushing on the best of days.

Thank **** for the electoral college or the entire country might be run like CA. We were so dangerously close to having Clinton as POTUS, it's downright frightening. I hope that was a wake-up call for everyone to become informed and take part in voting to try and isolate the liberal damage to the left coast.

Full disclosure, I'm a liberal myself, but only socially. I'm still a fiscal conservative. I dont care who does what what as long as they don't come to the taxpayers when their ****** life choices leave them ******. My liberalism does a hard stop when personal accountability is replaced by entitlement and growing an already out of control government that we should be desperately trying to reign in and remove from our personal choices/lives.

I definitely feel your pain and I'm glad you escaped that nightmare. ID is still largely a pretty damn decent state so probably quite an upgrade.

 

[GuruedVMax]

And on a different note, I see that 2 Democrat members of Congress have switched parties in less than 24 hours. One going Republican and one going Independent though he stated he 'leans' heavily Republican and votes most of the time with the Republican Caucus.

It was refreshing to see some actual dialogue going on here. People who I've vehemently disagreed with up until say a week ago, made some very strong and valid points, Kronx for example.... I never saw myself agreeing with him, but his last two comments were pretty much spot on.... well stated, Sir...

I agree with CaseyJones, I don't give two cents what people do, particularly in the privacy of their homes, as long as their choices do not negatively affect anyone else.

I also feel that had the 'Hildebeast' been elected POTUS, there is a very good chance that a major armed revolution of some type would have already been underway. I live in Middle Eastern Tennessee and I can guarantee you that with the exception of half of Nashville, some of Knoxville, and part of Chattanooga; we don't want any part of any Liberal BS here. I was in Outback Steakhouse in Cookeville about six months ago and an elderly couple came in and he was wearing a MAGA ball cap. Well these two couples I'm guessing early forties, started harassing him. Within 45 seconds, guys from 5 tables got up and literally escorted them to the door.... and they were not nice about it. And I can neither confirm nor deny I was one of them...

Please keep the dialogue going. This, against all odds, has turned into a very civil, very informative thread. Congrats to all of us....

 

[rynoman]

Once again CA shoots themselves in the foot with counterproductive policy and law. Seems they are intent on taxing and regulating many industries and individuals right out the door. They not only fail to protect tax payers, they are overtly hostile to them. CA has spread almost all the way north up the left coast. I was born in SoCal, dad passed in late 70s when I was still young, and it wasnt two weeks later CA was in our rear view mirror for good. There were a lot of people leaving WA when I left in 05 too, but so many more flooding in from CA that the population grew immensely in the time I was there. Many of them were pretty alright but many others brought their California ways with them and ****** up the whole western chunk of the state.

I fear ID is in danger of the same thing. My favorite cuz lives in Nampa valley, I often hear in vivid detail how it has changed in recent years. Thankfully ID is still full of great scenery and state law is still reasonable. It's probably more vital than ever to encourage those you know to be active voters in that area to prevent further damage from a leftward shift. Political leanings aside there are just soooo ******* many people on the west coast that it's unlivable. There is no getting away, the overcrowding and traffic are soul crushing on the best of days.

Thank **** for the electoral college or the entire country might be run like CA. We were so dangerously close to having Clinton as POTUS, it's downright frightening. I hope that was a wake-up call for everyone to become informed and take part in voting to try and isolate the liberal damage to the left coast.

Full disclosure, I'm a liberal myself, but only socially. I'm still a fiscal conservative. I dont care who does what what as long as they don't come to the taxpayers when their ****** life choices leave them ******. My liberalism does a hard stop when personal accountability is replaced by entitlement and growing an already out of control government that we should be desperately trying to reign in and remove from our personal choices/lives.

I definitely feel your pain and I'm glad you escaped that nightmare. ID is still largely a pretty damn decent state so probably quite an upgrade.

Yep, yep, yep, and yep. Lol! Sounds like you identify as a (original) liberal in the true sense. I call them "the old liberals", I just didn't want to call you old. Lol. The original liberals embrace the constitution and just want to be left alone. And I definitely get that. I always distinguish (old) liberals from (contemporary) progressives. BIG difference. I have a good friend (beer drinkin' buddy) that actually describes himself Exactly as you did, "socially liberal and fiscally conservative". We still have some spirited conversation though. Lol! Especially after we get a few high octane beers in our guts.

What a great place CA use to be. I knew that I would not live my whole life in that state by the time I was in my mid-twenties. Don't know how bad it's gonna have to get there before people (progressives) realize the error of their ways. Oregon, Washington, and now Idaho have/are been/being changed, and CLEARLY not for the better, from immigration of Californians. I can speak freely about it because although I'm from there, I haven't been a "Californian" for a LONG time. I didn't leave that place, it left me. I grew up and have remained a Constitutional centered American and I'm probably more of a Libertarian than anything. The typical Californian (if they're even a f*ckin US citizen) is a hypocritical, self-serving, narcissistic, self aggrandizing, apathetic, pretentious/poser, opportunist *******. Oh sure, they present themselves as being morally better people. But their actions say otherwise. And they embrace socialism and sharing of the spoils. Yeah, they want to share the spoils of everyone else's labors because most of the lazy, confused, overpaid, cock-suckers don't have one bit of self discipline so they don't have **** to share. Much of the (paper) wealth in California is from equity awarded to people for just being a homeowner (whether or not they pay their mortgage and live up to contractual obligations or not) and credit. A LOT more comes from overpaid government entitlement jobs and the golden defined benefit pensions that come with them. They rob wealth from the private-sector and award it to the public-sector in exchange for political loyalty at the polls.

Every time one of those lunatic *******s does something stupid or unnatural, they think they need to pass ANOTHER new law to regulate everyone. The typical Californian has no interest in practicing moderation or self control of excess in their life, but the hypocrite *******s will self appoint themselves to tell the rest of us that we need to cut back or "pay our fair share", all while the rest of us are the ones that have been moderate in our actions and the ones that have already been carrying THEIR water. The short sighted pricks will vote for anything that immediately butters their bread, even though it will immediately screw someone else and even when any moron could see that the long term affects are going to screw everyone. The "Cali" m.o. is "I got mine". Self-sacrifice, accountability, and honor are just a few words that are rarely uttered within the California borders (except on a movie set), let alone practiced. The waste I use to witness was nauseating. But it's okay cuz they recycle or pass another law that symbolizes that they are "green". Virtue signaling, hypocrite, *******s will scream environmentalism while they stand at the southern border and hold the gate open for an endless amount of third world people that come from a scorched earth society and have no idea, or any cognitive desire or intention of changing. And the import of illegal aliens is done to perpetuate the democrat stronghold. To hell with everyone else's quality of life and the American dream be damned, their "gonna get theirs". "Environmentalism" in Kalifornia (and the world for that matter) is a dog and pony show designed to separate the citizens from MORE of their hard earned money, but to some it has become a religion. The "Earth God". As for me, I'm %100 for ecology and being a good steward of the planet. I truly love trees but I hate Tree-Huggers. I'm for more practice, less preach. I grew up hearing; "waste not, want not", "don't piss upstream from where you drink", "don't **** where you eat", etc. But don't think for a minute that your gonna live in Kalifornia and apply these good practices without being punished and having to pay the "green tax".

When you vote in Kalifornia it may or may not be a waste of time. It depends on how the vote turns out and the desired outcome from the point of view of the socialist-democrat over-lords that run the place. In the mid to late 90's, Kalifornia put affirmative action up for vote (should California continue to give jobs, college admissions, etc. to people based on their skin color and not on merit). The good people of California popularly voted to remove it. That wasn't the desired outcome of the despots, sooo.. they put it to the vote again. And again "affirmative action" was defeated by popular vote. Sooo... the obvious next step for the naked Marxist *******s to do was to have one, (1), uno activist judge make a "ruling" on the "democratic process". And, so the racism in Kalifornia continues orchestrated from the democrat leadership. Then, they did a repeat with gay marriage and proposition 8. See democrats love Democracy so long as it fits their narrative. They are the playwrights in Kalifornia.

Kalifornia progressives SCREAM diversity and damn western civilization and the American culture. They act impulsively based on emotion. They think that they are Intellectually superior to their objective-thinking counterparts. I would love to put a half dozen Islamic zealots in a locked room with a half dozen LGBTQ members and watch the fray. Sounds mean, but that's exactly what the delusional progressive cock-suckers want to do to the rest of us when they inject people with a culture that is simply not compliant with our culture and the US Constitution. And speaking of the "rainbow community" in Kalifornia, I could give a **** less what they do in their bedroom. It ain't none of my business! I wish they could reciprocate the same courtesy and respect for the non-gay community. Instead the militant cock-suckers want to force everyone to like, respect, and pay homage to them. They want everyone to embrace them for their bravery. LOL! Hell, I'm old enough to remember when they "just wanted everyone to stay out of THEIR bedroom", now I can't keep those f*ckers out of MY livingroom.


Pretty much, the typical Kalifornian claims to be everything they really aren't. All this and they have clearly expressed that they have absolutely no interest in even starting to correct the course they are on and that they will fight anyone or any policies that would. There are still some good people in California and we always said that if you could go right up interstate 5 from southern California to the top of Washington with a large saw and cut off everything to the left side, California, Oregon, and Washington would be good again.